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First FE driving impressions

October 1 2017 at 8:27 AM
jgkurz  (Login jgkurz)
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First some back story. I have shared this with a few folks already, but not to the wider group. I finally got my Mustang back on the road after a 2yr long build and restoration. I bought my 69 Mach1 in 2013. The original 428/C6 were long gone. In the engine bay was a 1970 429 with a C6. Yes, a 385 series Lima engine. I was tempted for a moment to build a 557 stroker, but in the end, I decided to go back to an FE. The project was my first classic Ford and first FE so lots to learn. It’s probably fate that I have an FE. My father worked for Ford for 42 years and was the biggest FE fan I know. In hindsight I should have had an FE project years ago. I found a 427 SO locally for a great deal so went that direction instead of a 428. My dad has several aftermarket parts which also helped keep the cost down. I worked with Blair Patrick on the design and build of the engine with my local machine shop doing the short block machining and assembly. The result was a 488ci that made 570HP/584TQ on a Superflow dyno. I made some changes based on what we learned on the dyno that should add even more HP. The engine has BBM heads, hydraulic roller cam, 10.5:1 compression, 2x4 intake and QuckFuel carbs. The transmission is a bit unique. I went with a 4R70W 4spd automatic with a lockup converter that is computer controlled and completely programmable. The car mostly will be on the street and drag raced on the weekends. The exterior and interior look intentionally stock. Under the hood is a different story.

Now for the fun stuff. The FE engine sounds amazing. I have built many cars but none that sounded like this 427. I am somewhat surprised at how many people know the FE sound is unique. I have a full 3” Magnaflow exhaust that I thought would hush the motor adequately. I was very wrong. The 14” oval straight through mufflers barely help. I don’t mind so much but it’s hard to get on the throttle without pissing people off. Ha! I took the car for its first drive and about put the car in the ditch. I have never had a car with so much torque off throttle. My 255/60-15 BFG’s are useless. I really have to be careful. It will lay down two black strips from a roll like no car I’ve ever owned. At the drag strip I will run 275/60-15 drag radials so traction should be better. I am hoping to run in the 11.50 range, but the car is heavy so not sure if I can get there. Crossing my fingers.

The transmission is doing well. I am still fine tuning the shift points and lockup. The stall was suppose to be 3000 but I think it's closer to 2000. I need to test more. I have 4:11 gears so overdrive is essential on the freeway. The engine doesn’t like to be under 2000 RPM so the 3-4 shift happens at about 2500 RPM. The brakes have been getting a workout. I was surprised that I have 10.5” of vacuum so my power brake booster is working fine. I do need every bit of braking the car has. I think the 69 power brakes with Porterfield pads are adequate but certainly not excellent.

This forum has been a big help over the last couple years. Thank you for answering my newbie posts and for being such a wealth of information. I hope to contribute back if I can.

IMG_9570

This is probably the fourth start with open headers and on my 2-post lift.
https://youtu.be/wVgSGDYUkxc






-John


    
This message has been edited by jgkurz on Oct 1, 2017 3:01 PM


 
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AuthorReply
Greg W
(Login gregwill16)
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Very nice!

October 1 2017, 9:21 AM 

Great job John very nice and sounds great, that's the best car and engine ever made in my opinion.

 
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Jim
(Login FormerlyCyclonic66)
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Very nice indeed. More on tranny?

October 1 2017, 9:59 AM 

I just abandoned the 4R70W idea because the QuickTime bell won't allow a large converter (truck project) and I didn't like the idea of the big adapter that uses a specific starter. Which path did you choose?
For others interested, QuickTime says a larger bell will be available in about 6 months.

I bet that tranny is awesome on the highway. They can take some power too.

 
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Tom P
(Login tomposthuma)
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very nice

October 1 2017, 10:11 AM 

Sounds and looks great.

 
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jgkurz
(Login jgkurz)
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Trans info

October 1 2017, 12:42 PM 

Thank you everyone for the kind words. The 4R70W was made possible by Broader Performance in Texas. The owner Jay is an FE fan and has a neat way of adapting the modern trans to an old FE. I had to find him an old "Cruis-o-Matic FE bell housing which he then adapts to the 4R70W after milling the case. The converter is also custom due to the depth of the pilot. I really like that I can use a Ford FE starter and bell. It looks stock under the hood. You will need a transmission controller, TPS on your EFI or carbs, custom mount, and custom shifter arms and rod. The work wasn't trivial, but the end result was worth it in my opinion.

 
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Jim
(Login FormerlyCyclonic66)
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Interesting

October 1 2017, 4:10 PM 

I left them multiple messages and never heard back...you can see my comments in the thread above.

Motor sounds awesome, by the way.

 
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Brent Lykins
(Login blykins)
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It will be faster than that....

October 1 2017, 12:16 PM 

I've got a customer with a '69 Mach 1 that ran a 11.20 @ 123 with a 575hp 408C that I built him 4 years ago. With a converter swap, he ended up at a 10.70 by the end of the season.


 
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jgkurz
(Login jgkurz)
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Re: It will be faster than that....

October 1 2017, 12:34 PM 

Well that is encouraging. I really can't run faster than 11.50 due to NHRA rules but it would be nice to know I could.


    
This message has been edited by jgkurz on Oct 1, 2017 12:34 PM


 
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Michael
(Login jjz103)
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Great car and story

October 1 2017, 2:49 PM 

Thanks for sharing that John

 
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Leland
(Login lhstanford)
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Nice job/ Nice car----Sounds real good

October 1 2017, 6:26 PM 


 
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Bill Johnson
(Login BadHenry)
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Nice work

October 2 2017, 3:48 AM 

I see your carb linkage operates both carbs together not like the factory setup,how does it fell?
[linked image]

Bill
66 Fairlane
427 dual quad

 
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SW
(Login Staceyanddee)
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Like button hit! n/m

October 2 2017, 6:31 AM 


 
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jgkurz
(Login jgkurz)
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Carb Linkage

October 2 2017, 7:07 AM 

Good eye Bill! As you saw, my linkage is not progressive. All four primaries open at the same time. This wasn’t necessarily done on purpose. This was the linkage I got with the original 427 so I used it. I do have progressive linkage available but the engine seems to respond well to all four barrels opening so I left the linkage in place.

Any reason I should re-consider the progressive linkage? I would guess mileage would be better since just two barrels would open at first.


 
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6667fan
(Login 6667fan)
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M/E Wagner plumbing

October 2 2017, 9:36 AM 

Sounds and looks great! The carbs tied together does not seem to be hurting throttle response off idle. That is a good sign. Mileage will take a hit yes.
Could you share your pcv plumbing? I can't see where all the hoses go to. I have a Wagner on my 483 and I used as it's source of vacuum the rear of the intake. My idle vacuum is only 6.5 hg. As such I don't have two circuits set up, only the cruise circuit. Thanks, JB.
[linked image]
Every second counts

 
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jgkurz
(Login jgkurz)
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Re: M/E Wagner plumbing

October 2 2017, 10:23 AM 

Nice engine JB! Is that a Fairlane engine compartment?

The folks at Wagner really put some thought into their adjustable PCV setup so I wanted to give it a try. The engineering behind it is sound. At some point I will probably add an oil separator between the PCV and vacuum. Both my QF carbs were tapped for a vacuum fitting in the rear of the base plate. Obviously our carbs are backwards on the manifold so the ports face forward. I added the 3/8 barbed fitting then plumbed -6AN to the PCV valve. I believe PCV's work best when connected to the carb base plate rather than the manifold vacuum port at the back of our manifold. I tapped both carbs and so the vacuum draw was equal to all cylinders. Maybe none of this mattered but in theory it made sense to me. I also didn't want to tap directly into a runner due to the A/F change that might occur to an individual cylinder.

Some 427 folks don't run a PCV which is fine. I think that's called the road draft style. I prefer a PCV because it should keep the oil cleaner and add a tiny bit of pan vacuum to seal the rings better.


 
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6667fan
(Login 6667fan)
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I understand the theory about the accumulation of the vapors

October 2 2017, 5:39 PM 

and getting them distributed evenly. Seems like you have it covered. My QFs don't have the base plate vacuum take offs. I have seen tunnel wedge intakes where the owner puts a vacuum port into the bridge between the front and rear carbs. In my case I monitor plugs four and eight. Yes, the car is a Fairlane, (67).
[linked image]
Every second counts

 
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