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electric compressor for PCP airgun

June 29 2010 at 11:31 AM
new2gun  (Login new2gun)
YC

Hello, I am new to PCP and have got an Evanix .22 Renegade. After using the hand pump for a few times, I decided that it's too tiring for me so I am looking into the possiblity of getting a small electric pump that can do about 150 bars. May I have some recommendation pls ? thanks in advance.

 
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LexingtonGreg
(Login LexingtonGreg)
YF

Have you done any research?

June 29 2010, 11:43 AM 

Because its not like a conventional 125 psi garage compressor. And there's certianly sticker shock. You're gonna need about $3000.00 give or take 500. And just so you know its not a typing mistake, that's three thousand dollars.

This why I consider PCP technology to still be in its infancy. Hand pumps are expensive and have a bad track record for long term durability, powered compressors are priced in the stratosphere, and the scuba tank route just sounds...exhausting, between hydros and refills.

I don't understand why someone can't come up with a compressor that's smaller, 110v compatable, slower running (via gear reduction...thus more torque), and liquid cooled that could say, fill a 180cc gun like a Marauder in 10 minutes. Have models available with an (exchangeable) cutoff switch for 220bar, 200bar, and 150bar.

If a hand pump was more reliable, I think I could have a 110v mechanical rig built (by your average bubbas at a machine shop) to cycle the pump with an electric motor for less than $3000. Say, maybe 1 stroke every 10 seconds.


 
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JohnnySweden
(Login JohnnySweden)

Why only 110V....?

June 29 2010, 1:45 PM 


Instead of normal 230V...?

http://airpang.bloggplatsen.se/

 
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(Login LexingtonGreg)
YF

110 volt is the standard in the United States

June 29 2010, 3:25 PM 

I'd like to know the historical reason why electrical service is not a worldwide standard. We only have 220V for clothes dryers, electric ovens, and Jacuzzi connections.

 
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Doug Owen
(Login DKOwen)
YC

It's somewhat cultural.....

June 29 2010, 3:33 PM 

"I'd like to know the historical reason why electrical service is not a worldwide standard"

At the start there were no standards (in fact Edison's power distribution was DC....). Safety concerns set the US at 110 Volts and the Japanese at 100 (indeed a 'lifesaver' in practice). Economy plays a part as well, higher voltages allow smaller wires (cheaper) in Europe and higher frequency (60 Hz) favors slightly smaller, lighter (and cheaper) transformers and motors.

Same sort of reasons we've had 6, 12 and 24 volt cars and trucks.

So now you know......

Doug Owen

 
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Doug Owen
(Login DKOwen)
YC

Standard power.....

June 29 2010, 3:26 PM 

In the states, 110 volts (at 15 or 20 amps) is the standard. Dozens of outlets (on several circuits) 'everywhere'. Some garages (but very very few appartments) have a single 220 volt outlet (for a dryer) in the garage or service porch. Since natural gas is a much cheaper source of heat here, most dryers aren't electric.

This limits you to one HP or so. Guys might like more, but there's just no place to plug it in. A '220 Volt only' uint would loose sales.

Doug Owen

 
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(Login JohnnySweden)

Allright....110V is not much....

June 29 2010, 5:26 PM 


We always use 110V with 10 amps, except for the stove and a outlet in the garage/basement that runs at 380V and 16 amps.

Natural gas is never used here since it's very expensive, beeing taxed as a fossil fuel.

http://airpang.bloggplatsen.se/

 
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Doug T
(Login Doug-T)
YF

120v or 240v is standard U.S. voltage

June 29 2010, 7:29 PM 

I work for an electrical utility supplying power to houses, businesses, industries, irrigation pumps, etc. 120/240v 60hz is the standard household voltage. As previously mentioned, higher voltages transmit over distance better (less voltage loss) and can use thinner wires. They also require more insulation and are more dangerous. Generally the larger the load is the higher voltage is required. A home/small business is usually 120/240v, an irrigation pump is usually 240v or 480v, an industrial customer can be served with primary voltage (4160v to 34,500v).

A 120v motor on a 10A circuit could draw 1200 watts before the circuit breaker/fuse should interrupt it. At 746 watts/hp that would be 1.6hp motor output.

I would LOVE a compressor in the $300-$500 range that would pump to 3000psi+.

 
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(Login JohnnySweden)

The US is a large country...

June 30 2010, 1:34 AM 


Why not use stronger current if that is a benefit over longer ranges..?

http://airpang.bloggplatsen.se/

 
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Glover, Walter
(Login Voltar1)
YFOT

Huh?

June 30 2010, 9:36 AM 

Electrical grids in Europe and America are likely the 'same'

Walter..

 
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Doug Owen
(Login DKOwen)
YC

Have *you* done any research?????

June 29 2010, 3:21 PM 

This is hardly a new idea (as it usually happens). FX made such a unit, several 'garage shops' have also made them or kits. Generally they are slow and don't last. Note AoA no longer has 'em 'cuz FX stopped:

https://www.airgunsofarizona.com/Review%20-%20FX%20Compressor%20-%20Tom%20Gaylord.html

Doug Owen

 
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(Login JohnnySuperDad)
YC

No trouble at all.....

June 29 2010, 4:04 PM 

I have an Airhogs 88CF Carbon Fiber tank, My Mrod gets about 50 fills from a tank of 4500PSI down to 2800 PSI. It costs $5.00 to fill the CF tank at my local dive shop and that happens once every other month for me. Hydro is good until April of 2015.

IMHO it is well worth it to get a tank if there is a place that can fill to 4500 PSI within a reasonable distance.

I have never looked back to my pump once. I shoot SO MUCH more now.

-JSD

 
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(Login JohnnySweden)

Why not go scuba...?

June 29 2010, 5:29 PM 


Here they are tested once in ten years, a fill is $8.00 USD and for my S200T it lasts about 10.000 pellets, before refilling.

http://airpang.bloggplatsen.se/

 
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(Login tkerrigan)
YF

Compressor

June 29 2010, 12:02 PM 

Check this site, Jim has a new compressor in his line.http://sheldensportinggoods.com/ I bought one of the 4.2 Kidde, works very well. The 2.1 Kidde are the new ones, a bit less $.

tkerrigan

 
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Adam SoCal
(Login shootistinsocal)

Shoebox compressor

June 29 2010, 12:11 PM 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao7aZe4ZQzo

Google "Shoebox compressor" and you can find out more information on it.

Photobucket

Adam in SoCal
AKA WalkOnKing

http://www.talonairgun.com

 
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(Login LexingtonGreg)
YF

That's a great looking little pump

June 29 2010, 12:29 PM 

Nice video in that its possible to see how the compressor works. I'll bet the cylinder gets super hot though. I'd like to see some focus on active cooling, like a cylinder with substantial fins (read that as an integrared heat sink) and a fan blowing on it, or a liquid cooled cylinder.

Maybe someone makes bolt-on heat sinks of the right diameter, something like this...
[linked image]

And a good high volume directional fan like this small squirrel cage type...
[linked image]

 
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(Login bigbore)
YFOT

Do you have readily available scuba support?

June 29 2010, 1:53 PM 

If there are any shops in the area it the easiest way to go.

[linked image]

 
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(Login Voltar1)
YFOT

I will be one of the Beta testers for the Mini Compressor

June 29 2010, 3:00 PM 

or Shoebox Compressor that Tom Kaye will release soon.

IMO ideally suited to a shooter with a bottle gun, HPA setup or a decent sized reservoir gun.
The idea being to allow it some time to top up the air pressure when finished shooting. It will take up to 4 hours to refill a 68 cubic inch 4500psi HPA tank.

I was a detractor as I could not believe it would be possible. Now Tom has entrusted me to critique it and prove its functionality for airgunners. (was developed for paintballers)

Should have it in hand in a week or so.

Walter....

oh yes so far looks real fine at $390usd.

 
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(Login csdilligaf)
YC

It will be clean moisture free air correct? I'll buy one.

June 29 2010, 4:23 PM 

That is a great price range that most of us will go for in a heartbeat. Its the $1800-$2500 range that is keeping me from one.

 
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(Login Voltar1)
YFOT

Chip, to hold the price point there is no filtration or water traps

June 29 2010, 4:29 PM 

so if you deired better air then you would need to add to the compressor.

Will know more soon. I can get a dewpoint reading for you if that helps.
It uses shop air for first stage, again to save money, and so as clean as you supply it will determine how clean the fill is.

Good question.

Walter....

 
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(Login JBoyenga)
YF

Will it be recommended to provide one's own water sep?

June 29 2010, 7:01 PM 

I have a conventional compressor and this time of year it takes very little run time to accumulate water in the traps. Aside from the corrosion arguments we've seen here before, do you see any harm coming from running a compressor directly to a gun (as normal procedure)without a water trap? Obviously, if a water separator is required, that would have to be added to the cost for a complete set-up. I look forward to your test.

 
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Glover, Walter
(Login Voltar1)
YFOT

For bottle guns not needed, but for a reservoir gun, maybe... but

June 29 2010, 11:07 PM 

it will be no different than using a handpump to fill a steel tube and so it will be up to the user.

I'm pondering that water seperator idear. Be good if it could be done economically...... mmmm

Will see how it goes once it gets here happy.gif

Walter....

 
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Kevin H.
(Login haywire1)
YFOT

Im on the waiting list.

June 29 2010, 11:07 PM 

The shoebox runs slow enough to not build excessive heat. An inline moisture filter between the compressors should remove a large portion of moisture before high compression. A twin pack of filters from Grainger is
$14.

Haywire

 
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(Login rzrbax)
YC

Can't wait for your critique on this nifty compressor

June 30 2010, 12:59 AM 

Let us know all the details. I knew a compressor to fill guns directly didn't have to cost an arm and a leg. New stuff.....gotta love it.

Bill

Bill Dempsey
bdempsey@swat.coop

 
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(Login Voltar1)
YFOT

Thanks Bill, I'll do my best to check it out and answer questions

June 30 2010, 2:18 PM 

Will be working with Tom of course and so there will be discussion between us about my findings.
When clear to do so I will post in all the forums I frequent.

Cheers,
Walter....

 
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