Is it judt me, or are there really some nudist people who are anti-sex?
There seem, to be some Christians nudists who in order to make it quite clear that naturism and nudity isn't sexual, sometimes go too far as to make sex a 'bad' thing.
Who created sex in the first place? I'm not saying that all nudists support abusive sexual behaviour, but I feel that some nudists and Christians can be very narrow minded about sexual behaviour when their non-nudist friends are at least a bit more open and understanding.
This is not to say that I am in favour of swinging or promiscuous sexusl behaviour, but I think that one of the appeals of naturism is the more honest and wholesome sexuality you find rather than at more lewd joints such as brothels and strip-clubs.
Christian nudists aren't against sex. Most of us believe that sex is a private thing. Mentions of it in the Bible tell of people covering themselves when they do sex (e.g. Boas with Ruth; Ezekiel 15th or 16th chapters, about the girl growing up naked and finally getting pubic hair then the man covering her to have sex). We can do the same thing today by just shutting our doors or covering windows when having sex.
If we just go about our business nude when no protection against bodily harm is needed, it'll just be a natural thing and actually will desensitise us to seeing the naked body just for sex. This is exactly what happens at nudist clubs and nudist events. There generally isn't a problem with males getting erections, etc. like a lot of people think.
I go about my work around my house and property naked. Folks know to give me a call ahead of time if they don't want to catch me nude. One neighbor toots her horn about 1/3 way up the driveway. Some, like the postal lady, just drives on in if she has a package to deliver.
You wrote:
"e.g. Boas with Ruth; Ezekiel 15th or 16th chapters, about the girl growing up naked and finally getting pubic hair then the man covering her to have sex)."
Ezekiel 16 is an interesting passage. It's been a while since I last read this book, and I had forgotten about that passage.
It's important to remember that this book is highly allegorical (symbolic), so it's hard to know for sure how much it reflected the actual practices within the culture. My understanding of the Jewish culture is that it was quite body-modest. No doubt small children were allowed to run naked, but it's hard for me to think that this continued until puberty—particularly in the case of a girl.
It may have been different for slaves, which leads me to say that in some of the surrounding cultures slaves routinely were naked. One of the differences between slave and free in Egypt was that free people were some clothing.
The passage describes a newborn girlchild who was thrown away at birth. This may have been more likely to be the fate of a child born to slavery, so the symbolism may be reminding Jerusalem of how God rescued them when they were slaves in Egypt.
In any event I don't think we would want to argue that God was planning to have sex with Jerusalem (the passage is about God's relationships with the city). "I covered your naked body with my own robe" symbolizes God throwing his protection over a young woman (Jerusalem) who was vulnerable to assault. This would have been a powerful image in that culture.
Sometimes, you might get that idea from a very few select naturist groups that can go into extremes.
Mind you, I enjoy sex. I enjoy being nude.
The funny thing is, I was enjoying sex before I became a naturist. Sex was built into humanity, nude is how they were created. They were also created with hair on top of their head, but doesn't mean that hair is related to sex or nudity. Thank Goodness for that since I'm losing my hair on my head, it doesnt' affect me sexually!
Do we associate sex with nudity? Often it has been associated because people have assumed and been incorrectly taught that Adam and Eves sin was sex related, after all, they were nude, right? Far from the truth. They sinned because they took to themselves the knowledge of what is good and evil. They rejected the Tree of life...it was just as available to them, but they went to the other instead.
Sex is all over. The "act" doesn't last as long as the mind before, during and after, on the subject. In fact, we are talking about it right now, yet I am currently clothed (sorry about that, at work) and typing on a PC trying to figure out why I cannot get a new password to this site so I can edit it again.
How often have you noticed a [member of the opposite sex] who was fully clothed, and had sexual attraction? The face, the hair, the eyes, the lips, the walk, the talk, the body language...and that is just the beginning. How often has someone touched you on the arm or face and you felt sexual attraction? Had absolutely nothing to do with nudity, or what we assume are sexual organs. Yes, they are sexual organs, but I think the entire body, including and especially the mind, is also a sexual organ. It is said that the skin is the largest, but I'm sure the mind is the most complex. So you want a large sex organ? Look at your entire skin.
We do not, as a self regulating rule, associate naturism with sex. Do we have sex? You bet! But NOT because we are nude, (though it is convenient) but because God created it for us and we enjoy it. We do not make a public display of it. We are private about it just as non naturists do. But because we are comfortable with our bodies, we know we are free, we don't "do the dance", turn out the lights and "hide" from each other (partners).
Uh...guess I better get back to work...while I still have a job. We got notice that we are to be replaced by Contract in February.
RE:""""Do we associate sex with nudity? Often it has been associated because people have assumed that Adam and Eves sin was sex related""""
Factually Bible shows out that first couple had a children long after throwing off from the Eden, it clearly indicates that they HAD NO sex inside the Garden, inspite the God commanded them to do "multiplying". They lived many years long without of the sex!!! And if they would been more obedient to the God, they perhaps would give a birth to the number of children before falling sinful, and accordingly the World History would been rewritten, for those children would had a chances to stay sin-free. Just immagine how many challenges would stay unneccessary, from Christ sacrifice to Slavery and World Wars.
So SOMETIMES appropriate sex is better solution as no sex at all. Of course the dogging i.e. public sex I heavily wonder if may be useful, if any are free to do it in privacy. And it certainly would not give a glory to the name of naturist or christian if thy would support it. IMHO the public opinion is the main reason today, why naturists are against a dogging.
I don't think there's any proof at all of Adam & Eve not having any sex in the Garden. If you think it's because of no children for a while, that's no proof. You can have sex without having kids. Otherwise, there'd be a kid virtually every year from every wife. That didn't and still doesn't happen.
You wrote "it clearly indicates that they HAD NO sex inside the Garden". Clearly?
You also assumed they were in there for years.
I'd like to know where you are really going with this? Apparently, you are wanting to find reasons to have sex in public.
Try not to make assumptions without proof:
"Naturists are against sex" (because they don't have it in public).
"Adam and Eve did not have sex in the garden"
"Adam and Eve lived there for years" etc.
Please, accept our answers as experienced naturists. We have been there, we have talked to other naturists, and I'm sure you know my wife and I are naturists and our baby didn't come from a stork.
I think Johny's point is easily misunderstood, but I do not think he is advocating public sex at a nude beach or nudist resort. Instead, he simply seems to be asking what motivates us to refrain from it. Do we as nudists refrain from sex within sight of other nudists at nudist venues because we fear that textile society will conclude that nudism is about sex?
If there were some way to guarantee that neither nudism nor Christianity would not be disgraced and no laws were broken, is there any MORAL reason to object to a man and his wife making love outdoors where there was a reasonable chance that they would be seen by others?
I contend that there is a very clear reason: While platonic nudity causes no sexual arousal in seasoned nudists, there is a distinct possibility that some onlookers would be tempted to adulterous thoughts. For that simple reason, Christian couples would always want a place (indoors or out) where their lovemaking would be assured of privacy.
Secondly, even in a sinless world, where nudity would be universal, the notion of privacy during lovemaking would still not be negated. There is something sacred to the physical and mental union of a man and his wife that almost demands that it be a solitary experience.
Lastly, lovemaking should be engaged where distractions will be minimal and only solitary places can provide the optimal environment for this. (Hint: turn off your cell phones and pagers, please!)
Nudism's detractors frequently and most incorrectly assume that nudism is something sexual, so some of the most opinionated of these critics also assume that at nudist venues we openly engage in wild sex before the the gawking eyes of our fellow nudists. I think this attitude is the source of posts that mockingly ask us why we object to public sex if we don't have any qualms about public nudity.
Well, at the risk of preaching to the choir, let me reaffirm that Christian nudists and most other nudists cherish privacy when lovemaking. We are nude when possible because God intended that for us. We just as firmly insist that clothing does not confer privacy, nor does the absence of clothing provide privacy.
Two stories in the Bible tell us that sex is supposed to be private. One is the story of the girl growing up in Ezekial chapter 15 or 16. The other is of Ruth and Boaz in the book of Esther. In both of these, they tell of the man covering the 2 of them when having sex.
The translators of many of the earlier versions of the Bible also had that idea in translating "not having sex with..." as "uncovering the nakedness of...". Not sure how far you could carry this concept though.
I wish that we could eliminate the sex scenes in movies except those movies dedicated to teaching us about such things. Nudity should not be associated with sex. Nudity is a pure relationship with the clouds and the sky, our God and doing things unemcombered. All things are better done naked, including sex, but let's keep the sex private or just in books or movies devoted to just that.
