Hi,

There has been a lot of debate about this on the 'news' group rec.nude recently, with a lot of fingerpointing and nasty name-calling being flung from all four corners.

These videos focus a lot on teenage girls engaged in fun activities such as partying, dancing, exercising, and skinnydipping often with their families involved.

The question is whether the directors are helping the naturist movement to gain new converts this way, or are they simply making money out of sexualising the children?

Have your say!


Dario Western

I have seen a lot of the Holy Nature site and it is clearly a money-making venture. Everything is staged.

It does not help our cause. It is not porn because it does not depict sexual activity. However, it is exploitative and targets a potentially lustful audience.

Hint: Better get a good spam blocker before you visit that site.

All this depends on the beholder. Some may see families having fun, others may see it very differntly. If you see it as families having fun then I can't see that you have a problem, however if you see it otherwise then you may need to look at your self and examine your own attitudes to sex and stimulation. Some people see nudism and magazines which promote the life style as soft porn. Some see soft porn in the National Geografic.
tevita

Some people can see "porn" anywhere. My mother for instance.

But as far as the sites mentioned and others like them; while naturists may see the videos as a bit lopsided in who they show engaging in naked fun, you need to remember that pretty young girls, and especially pretty young NAKED girls, will draw more people to the product than just about anything else.

While many will see these videos as exploitive, and I don't necessarily disagree, they're just putting on our best face.

Think about it: if you're trying to put a positive spin on naturisn, which would most people rather see- a pretty young girl in, uh... obviously good physical condition, or an overweight middle age man drinking a beer while smoking a cigarette?

While most nudists would say that both people are equally attractive, as people , honesty will admit that most would rather watch the girl than the man.

Just the way it is, and although I do agree that it's just to make money, maybe somebody will get involved in naturism to see the girls, find out what naturism is REALLY about, and be a convert for life!!

God Bless
Kevin

Holy Nature did not offend me personally, except I was annoyed with the spam I got after I visited their site.

The girls really were attractive, but I think we can do better with our representation of nudism. Tevita, there is no way that these were family units. It's okay for nudism to pose their young people, but it should also be clear that couples, singles, people who are ordinary looking can be nudists too.
I love forums because it encourages people to participate.

Will Holy Nature encourage young people to become nudists? Maybe, but a lot of other places like INA seem to really make that their goal and are reaching lots more people.

I agree.

The videos that I have seen on-line and advertised in magazines appear to be okay (I've never actually seen one), but as you said the people shown are obviously not families.

Maybe we need to make our OWN, to show the world what it's really all about!!

Later
K

Sexuality will be exploited and it can always be taken the wrong way because it is a taboo subject even among nudists it seems. Though the portrayal of what is the so-called standard in society of beauty to the exclusion of other types of beauty is not so good since beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Joe

So I can't say.

Have you seen the videos? Maybe you can tell us what is really there.

However, are pedophiles getting the videos? Probably and most likely, yes. It is sad, but probably true. Can it be stopped? Only when they quit creating the videos and selling them, especially with that many children on the website advertsing it. Even though I don't have any nude pictures of my child, I wouldn't post her online anyway. There are enough problems out there without asking for more.

Maybe Russia doesn't realize that how they view their children innocently, may disturb others in other countries. I think it is more on how we think of children than how they think of them. They may have more respect for their children than we do. Apparently, we Americans think of sex everytime a picture of a nude child appears. That is our problem, not the child or the person who took the picture. Personally, I think you can prove child pornography on the person viewing just as easy as you can the person who took the picture, because the picture was innocent until the viewer thought "child sex" merely by viewing it.

Boyd

There was a case here in Australia last year when a mature age university student doing an degree in fine arts was prosecuted for taking photographs of her own children in the nude for her assignment. She took the picture of her son(5) and daughter(4) after they had just got out of the bath and were covered in soap-suds. The developer sent the film in to the police who took it further. She was lucky the the Art Department of her Uni took up her defence and she got off. However this has caused others to think again before using such material.
I remember that my brother and I took a photo of his daughter and my son and my older daughter in the bath together when the had not yet started school. My wife did not think that anyone would be offended but when she sent the pictrure to her family (very consevative Pacific Islanders from a old fashioned Methoidist background) they were not pleased and even told the young kids in the family that our kids had bathers on which were under the water.
I would hate it if we protect our kids so much that they no longer can have the sort of fun we did as kids. The world is no more dangerous now, its just more pubisized about the dangers. We have created a generation of "couch potatoes" that obtain their entertainment by watching TV and playing computer games, because we were too afraid as a society of litigation from children becoming hurt. Just think about it, how much fun did we have as kids playing in creeks and up trees that kids just don't do these days. Its not the parents who have done this it is society in general and the attitude at schools etc. Our young have been conditioned to see out door activity, exploring and taking risks as being too dangerous. The best form of protection we can do with our kids is not to limit their activities but to educte them on first aid and how to make judge ments about people.
I have worked in the area of treatment of abused children and it is interesting that almost all abusers were close family members or long time freinds of the family. It is very rare for the danger to come from stangers.
Pedophiles are attracted to churches or church based organisations for youth more often than not. It is these people that need to be watrched out for but I will not stop my young from going to church or a cchurch youth group!
Sorry yet another soapbox stand from Tevita.

Dear Tevita,

This reply from you has just hit me in the head and the heart.

Unfortunately, I have gradually become one of these couch potatoes whose only relationshiop to kids is watching kids tv shows and playing the odd computer game.

The TV seems to make out that the world has since become a very perverted place, and really underestimates human intyergrity, especially that of children. How anybody can find cute pics of kids playing in the bath to be erotic is beyond me.

What warped minds have they got?! I was photographed in the bath a few times by my parents and they never laid a finger on me!

It's become ridiculous now - but that's life.


Dario Western