This discussion group is for all you gear-heads, techno-nuts, tinker freaks, backyard airsmiths, engineers, machinists,
miscellaneous do-it-yourselfers and any other mechanically enlightened gadget junkie that enjoys working on paintball equipment.
While we would prefer to keep the topic focused on purely technical matters, please feel free to discuss anything paintball related that may be of interest.
Many questions have popped up repeatedly- They've been archived
for your Tinkering pleasure in both the Frequently-Asked Tinker's (FAT) and the Rat's Nest.

For non-paintball technical discussion, or if you'd like to sell paintball gear, please use one of the link buttons below:

So I Bought This Minimag

by RA

The Paypal account is making these impulse buys too easy! Back in 90's I bought a brand new Minimag with money I got from a safety suggestion I turned in at work. It was the best PB gun I had ever owned at the time. I played a few years with it and never had a problem. When I thought I was done playing I sold it.

I saw this on another forum and in a case of pure case of nostalgia I decided to get it. Kinda like getting that muscle car back you had in college!

[IMG][linked image][/IMG]

[IMG][linked image][/IMG]

Now I wonder if it's going to be worth it to update it. What do you guys think? What would you get for it for woodsball/scenario action?

My first thoughts were a double trigger, a RT valve, and maybe a ULE body. How many hundreds of dollars will that cost???

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 5:59 PM

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After all that.....

by Renegade_Azzy

You will have almost an entirely new gun. I would just build another to go ULE and RT with. Then you can have your older gun, and your hotrod.

Old hotness... new hotness.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 8:00 PM

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I agree...

by Joni

I would consider getting a lvl10 however. No breaks always helps i a game.

Keep the rest stock after that, it makes a nice indestructible woodsball gun.

Posted on Nov 11, 2009, 3:27 AM

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O/T: Electric Superchargers?

by TheGodfather

I was recently rambling to a friend about the lack of performance upgrades available for my car (which shouldn't be a surprise, since it's a 2000 Chevy Malibu) and he mentioned these little electric superchargers that can be had for a few hundred bucks. Example:http://www.yourhotcar.com/prod/Custom/Air_Intakes/All/E-Ram_SUPERCHARGER_1_PSI_Boost/17960/

To me, this little contraption that looks like it's little mote 12 volt fan Jerry-rigged into the intake. Is this worth taking seriously or should i just save the time and money for something worthwhile (like thishttp://www.mpracing.org/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=351 )

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 12:59 PM

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I've yet to see a good review of them

by Hans

I just don't see a small electric motor developing any real pressure in there. Heck, the advertisement is only claiming 1psi boost. That's just not enough pressure to give any real effect. Most true turbo and superchargers are running much higher levels than that, into the teens easily for street cars.

And it draws 60 amps of power? I can only imagine the load being placed on your electrical system to maintain that as you drive. I also don't see the supplied wiring being up tp the task either.

There's a lot of other ways to spend the same money for improved performance, without having some kludgy and questionable gimmick system installed. If this was worth anything at all, you would see at least ONE production car, from some company or big name performance shop, with a similar system installed as stock.

-Hans



Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:10 PM

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Yes and No

by

"To me, this little contraption that looks like it's little mote 12 volt fan Jerry-rigged into the intake. Is this worth taking seriously?"

Yes that's all it is, and no you should not take it seriously. As I recall from a friend who put one on his Tarus it actually sapped horsepower and mileage. The engine had to drive the stupid little fan at low rpms and at high speeds air flow was restricted by it.

If you want performance you have the wrong car,

Matt

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:15 PM

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About what I expected....

by TheGodfather

Pretty much what I though, just wanted the opinion of the wiser minds of the guild. As far as "having the wrong car", I'm not looking to run off to the drag strip with this thing, I'm just looking for a little more than what I've got, a little extra go for when some "tough guy" in his momma's civic/altima/corolla/whatever decides to start revving his engine at me at a stoplight. I'd love a new car, but that's simply not within my budget. Also, buying a car is a lump-sum type deal, while I can grab an upgrade or two every couple of months.

My current plan for the car is:

Step 1: the headers and hi-flo cat I linked in the first post

step 2: 28PSI fuel injectors (stock are 19 or 22 i believe) and a tune + PCM reprogramming to match them

Step 3 was going to be this thing, but it seems like an intake is much a better choice.

Step 4: wheels and tires

After that comes converting the rear drums to discs, lowering springs, a new hood and a partial body kit. total cost of around 4 grand, spread out over the next year or so.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:50 PM

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Why not just...

by Conqueror

...save up for a year and put that 4 grand toward a different car that doesn't have a worthless upgrade path and never provide a return on your investment?

CQ

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 3:54 PM

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You seriously asked that on THIS forum?

by

Buying something easier to modify isn't particularly in the Tinker's spirit now is it.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 4:42 PM

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well if your serious than take a look at supersix

by Kevin

www.supersixmotorsports.com

IIRC they also make parts for the gm 6 bangers. I wouldn't expect to see as good numbers though since the ford 3.8/4.2 is just a better motor to start with (as far as v6'rs go).

If your malibu uses the 3800 series motor than it might be easier to swap the already supercharged version in. IIRC the grand am/prix gtp came with them. And there is somewhat of an aftermarket for them since alot of the kit car guys use these for budget builds.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 5:26 PM

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This is the only one worth messing with.

by Flank

http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/0406tur_knight_turbo_electric_supercharger/index.html

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 8:00 PM

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Well...

by D D

I'd skip the lowering springs and body kit - that kind of stuff just screams "PUSSY" in 72-point font.

If it were up to me, I'd look to make the car have as much oomph as possible while retaining its stock appearance as far as possible.

Posted on Nov 11, 2009, 2:04 AM

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Last (and only) possibly promising news on that front I've seen:

by Surestick

Was this post on Jalopnik:
http://jalopnik.com/5365041/electric-supercharger-aimed-at-improving-efficiency-we-have-other-ideas
Not exactly full of info.
Even if it is for real and doesn't require major electrical system work to power it it's intended for smaller engines so you'd need several to feed a bigger engine which means more load on the electrical system, more weight, more space in the engine bay, etc...


Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 5:17 PM

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physics is fun

by tippmann1

simple physics.

on a traditional super-charger: the engine drives a pulley which turns a shaft connected to a compressor of some sort sending extra air into the engine.

on an electric super-charger: the engine drives a dynamo with sends electric current through wires to an electric motor that drives a shaft connected to a compressor or fan which sends air to the engine.

With each conversion of power you lose a good amount of energy to heat, and an small amount to light (remember that everything produces a tiny tiny bit of light). With an electric super-charger your converting from rotational energy to electrical energy sending it down a couple of wires and converting it right back again. An electric super-charger will never be as efficient as a traditional one.

However, if you had a gigantic power station that followed you around everywhere and a sufficiently large electric motor and a monster of a compressor then you could probably produce some real power out of that engine. happy.gif

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 9:32 PM

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Besides the fact...

by

... That belt-driven superchargers can eat up something like 5 to 20HP depending on type and amount of boost. (A Roots-style 14-71 on a top-fuel dragster sucks up some five hundred horsepower at full boost.)

Now think of how big a 5HP electric motor is.

Like the old commercial said- any questions? happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 11, 2009, 3:05 AM

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[OT] Searching for info on a false epidemic. Google-fu is weak

by Mark Frost

I read a story some time ago about a change in filling out death certificates (requiring a cause of death in all cases, or disallowing 'old age' as an option) led to doctors in the south choosing a disease (I think it was malaria) to fill in when it would normally be blank.

As a result, hundreds of people were listed as dying from this disease and it caused a bit of an uproar at the time (early 20th century).

I've searched all over and can't seem to get a hit.

Does this ring a bell for anyone?

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 9:26 AM

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polar bear lol cats

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2824621056
http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2824623104
http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2824627712
http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2824635136
http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2821929984
http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2814735360

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 8:43 AM

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If you search around this forum you can find a lolar bear i did at somepoint... n/t

by FireFrenzy

Nekkit Triggers

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 9:43 AM

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My contribution..NTJP

by BnS

[linked image]






Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 12:56 PM

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hahaha

by IDN

Its funny see'ing Doc Nickel in those funny poses, and that "reactor/some left" one was great!

I'm not clever enough to make one yet.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 4:01 PM

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never leave the panda cage unlocked.

by

http://www.break.com/index/panda-bears-make-daring-escape.html



Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 7:58 PM

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Paging PB josh

by

Hey since the emails keep getting "eaten", lets use the board.
Do you need my address again, been some time since 10/22/09. :P



Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:52 PM

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I have the Martian Death Flu

by pbjosh

And haven't been to the office. I should be in tomorrow. If you have the address in that email I can get it.

Going to bed (again)

Josh

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 8:10 PM

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I got vaccinated

by

No goody goody.
I got vaccinated for piggy flu and regular flu....and I swear if one more mouthbreathing jackass says I'm crazy and that vaccines are more likely to "give the flu", I'm going to snap!

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 9:46 PM

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Next year

by D D

Obviously too late for me to do so this flu season, but after the sheer hell I experienced a few weeks ago, I intend to get the shot every year from here on.

Posted on Nov 11, 2009, 1:54 AM

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You have my sympathy

by D D

I suffered through it a few weeks ago - still trying to lose the aftereffects. No fun at all.

Posted on Nov 11, 2009, 1:52 AM

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Handgun question...Bersa Thunder Plus .380

by

Looking at purchasing a handgun. This will be my first firearm purchase. Gonna use it for home/personal protection and range shooting. We went to the local gun store today and looked over all the selections. After handling all the firearms the Bersa Thunder Plus .380(15 mag)really felt the best in my hands. Just wanted to see the opinions of the board FOR THIS GUN ONLY before I decide. The lack of .380 ammunition is a definate downside to the gun. The salesman at the store said his father carries a Bersa Thunder .380(7 round mag) which makes me feel good about it. He also said the Bersa Company was really good at customer service citing his own personal experience. Any other info I might need to know?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:44 PM

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Bersa

by

Actually I've several times nearly purchased Bersa firearms for a concealed carry back up. They have spotty availability here in Alaska though, so when I had the cash none were available and when they were available I didn't have the cash. They seem well built for the money. I can't speak to the "Thunder" model, but it sounds like the double stack .380 model I looked at (under a different name) before deciding on the single stack model for even more concealability. They are not a Beretta, but the ones I handled had reasonable fit and finish as well as being decently engineered. They gunsmith that pointed me towards them thought well of them and as he's the one that built my 1911A1 and several of my S&W wheelguns, I'm inclined to trust him.

That said, .380 right now is tough to come by. The new Ruger .380 has contributed to the sudden popularity of the cartridge. Remember the .380 is sometimes referred to as the 9mm "Kurz" or 9mm short. It shoots a 9mm (.355") slug of a lighter weight then the 9mm Parabellum (Luger). The 9mm in standard loadings is roughly equivalent to the .38 Special. The .380 is less powerful. Using high quality factory ammo (say Glasers) the .380 comes close, but the 9mm or .38 special in similar quality out perform it. Right now both the 9mm and .38 Special are far easier to come by. .380 is the ABSOLUTE minimum I'd consider for a carry cartridge (I'd actually pick a .22LR before I'd pick a .25 ACP or .32 ACP). There are several 9mms out there that are every bit as concealable as the .380. The new Ruger LCR in .38 special is VERY light and VERY concealable. It will be my next firearm purchase unless I come across an SP101 .357 at a nice price.

Back to the Bersa though, I can't say anything bad about them or the loaner I shot. Performed well. I'd be more worried about the availability of ammo right now then the quality of the weapon. Even a handloader like me can pull teeth trying to find all the right components right now--though it is getting better.

Dago

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 5:52 PM

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Agreeing with most of Dago's, above.

by Deus Machina

Great guns for the money, and Bersa does hold up their customer service, but was slow the last I checked--they had problems getting their manufacturers running enough parts (like magazines) to supply their personal contracts, let alone their imported civilian market. That may have gotten better.

In summary, if you don't want to read any further: if you can get the ammo, it's a great buy.

The additions:

Nothing wrong with .380 if you can put a hole where you need to, and that's why, right now, I would not suggest a .380. If you're familiar with handguns, or will also buy a .22LR or something to practice with (Bersa makes .22's in the same frame, under the name 'Firestorm'), and can get enough ammunition to become familiar with your defense gun in particular, then by all means.

But the less power you have, the less you can be off bullseye, and I'm not one to believe you can afford to be far off with a .500 S&W.

Plenty of 9mm or .40 handguns out there that work as well. The gun is more expensive, but the ammo will be cheaper right now. More to practice with. And the recoil in a locked-breach 9mm or .40 can often be roughly equivalent to that of the blowback .380 designs. CZ in particular tends to make some very easy-handling 9mm pistols. And the Rami is roughly the same size as the Bersa, just for comparison. CZ fanboy here, don't take it as a 'buy this instead.'

Also, not a fan of Glaser ammunition, especially in rounds where you don't have power to spare like you would with .357 or 10mm. They make for numerous but very small cavities, and dump energy too fast for my taste.
My preference to defense rounds in a .380 would be Cor-Bon DPX (first and foremoest; very impressive for the weight), Remington Golden Sabers, Speer Gold Dots, Cor-Bon Pow'R'Ball if it has trouble feeding HP's, and all flavors of Fiocchi hollowpoints. In .380, you really do have to consider penetration up against expansion.

On the plus side, if you ever have to draw it, there's a great chance you don't have to fire. If you ever do have to fire, rely on trained aim, not the round. FMJ is never better than anything that expands, IMO, as long as they feet, but if you can put a couple holes right where you need to, it doesn't matter what round you put them there with.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 7:58 PM

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If that's what feels the best-

by Lis

Get it.

I've heard they aren't bad for the money. The guy was looking into one of those a year or so ago, but went with a PPK since he preferred the construction and feel of the Walther. From what he saw during the time, the reviews were decent enough and I didn't run into any one with a really bad experience. It didn't tickle my fancy, but than again I seem to be drawn to the .45 frame style. (I'd love a Colt Pony if I ever find one for a good price when I have money!)

I'm a big fan of that whole get what feels the best when you shoot it thing. .380 ammo shows up from time to time. Just stock up when you see it, ditto on components if you reload!

Good luck, and go with the gun you like the best- screw what everyone else says!

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:14 PM

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I have the single-stack model...

by Dulie

Nice little pistol, it's my one I carry when I ride bicycle and is my summer carry. It's also the one I bring along in deep cover (under my winter clothes) in a shoulder holster for dispatching wounded critters when I hunt since I don't have a .22 pistol yet.

I use Hornady TAP in .380, nice ammo, tough to come by since Cabela's has the corner on that market, but I have one an hour away.

It's a nice gun to start with...but I like my Sig P6 better, just that it's tougher to conceal in the summer. But, my Sig was $200 more than my Bersa (the Sig is German Police surplus).

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 8:41 AM

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.380

by Renegade_Azzy

I have a Ruger in .380, and can say for a range gun, given the availability of ammo and higher powered rounds in a small pistol... it isnt delightful to shoot. Not bad, but not as nice as some of my other pistols. I do practice with the things as it is a carry weapon. Higher power +P Corbon rounds are not nice to shoot (even if you discount the price of those rounds) at all.

Small and barkey, much more so than a small j frame revolver.

Just something to think about. With the price of ammo these days, ive switched to .22 for basic marksmanship practice, and fun plinking.

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 11:49 AM

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Bersa... and .380...

by Conqueror

Bersa makes good firearms, I don't think it's a bad purchase.

I DO think .380 in general is a bad purchase, though. Why anyone would want a less-effective, more-expensive version of 9mm is beyond me. I would be hunting for a 9mm. There are so many options that you're almost guaranteed to find something that fits your hand as well as the Bersa.

CQ

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:30 PM

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Kahr 9mm

by RA

Kahr makes a few small 9mm's and that's what I would be looking at instead of a .380.



Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:45 PM

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I would suggest the Kahr 9mm or the Kahr .380

by Aaron (aka)

I've had a Kahr 9mm for carry, it is a great gun and can take a lot of punihment and will be getting another one next year. Though I'll also be getting a Kahr .380 once it comes out with nightsites early next year for carry. A good freind has already tryed the Kahr .380 and it is very compact. Of the shooters at the range the Kahr .380 was liked better than the Ruger. As for a home defense gun get something bigger less concealable, maybe something you can put a light on if you know how to use those with a pistol. Put it you want a gun that can fit both roles unit you have more cash to buy more guns. The standard Kahr 9mm should fit both.

If you have freinds with pistols try as many as you can before buying to get a feel of what you like.

Aaron

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 4:25 PM

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A question about gunsmithing

by Ed Z.

Forgive my ignorance, but I'm writing from behind former Iron Curtain and have no clue about how regulations considering gunsmithing look like in the U.S. of A. Does one need a certificate or something like that to fabricate gun parts? And how much trouble/expertise is that?

I'm asking because there may be a small niche for work in this area if any of the tinkers present here are interested. See, there is a small but dedicated following for the Polish 1960s-70s military surplus handgun, P-64, in the USA. It's an almost-Walther clone firing Makarov 9x18 ammo, which some people found to be their favourite as a concealed carry due to low price, reliability, relatively powerful round in a small and flat package, and great accuracy. The problem these folks have, there are virtually no spare parts available for this fine sidearm except for springs and custom handgrips - to the point that people buy 2 or three pieces just to have spares in case something breaks.

Check the forums athttp://p64.proboards.com/index.cgi and see for yourselves. An exceptionally fine and friendly bunch of people there. So my guess is if somebody here could do it and came up with small batches of the most needed parts for this gun, he/she would gain a lot of gratitude and a few bucks from the deal happy.gif

Ed.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:21 AM

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Actually that is 2 questions

by

1. What laws govern production of firearm parts in the US?

and

2. What are the import laws regarding importation of said parts?

OK, I'm not an expert. I'm gonna give you my understandings:

1. Some parts are ungoverned for the most part. Moving parts such as slide, trigger, grip, hammer, safety slide release, springs etc. that are of factory original design fall under this. Where it gets tricky is if you try to do something wild like make a full auto conversion kit or something. Those are STRICTLY regulated. Improved parts such as a different design to the trigger or hammer or what have you are fine as well. Large capacity magazines might be illegal in some states. The basic USA definition of the firearm itself is what is regulated, not so much after market parts. The firearm itself is considered the reciever which is the portion that has the serial number.

2. Certain firearms are prohibited for importation even today. Parts may fall under the same laws. You would need to contact the BATF to find out. Also, there may be additional custom fees and such (I import ornamental stone [granite] on a large scale so that is a consideration for me). Federal laws may vary from individual state laws (sic: california). Also there may be requirements for a certain amount of liability insurance for the parts you sell.

Hope that helps. Not as detailed as I would like, but at least a starting place.

Dago

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:00 PM

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Nov. 7th, when it all happened at The Wall

by Nighthawke

Ten years ago tonight, the decree for free travel was read to the press by Guenter Schabowsk, spokesman for the East German Politburo.

"It was nearly 7:00 pm on November 9 when Schabowski, at the time spokesman of the central committee of the ruling SED party, pulled a sheet of paper from his pocket and read out a decree stating that visas would be freely granted to those wanting to travel outside or leave the country.

"As of when?" asked an Italian journalist, Riccardo Ehrman of ANSA...

Schabowski hesitated and then improvised: "As far as I know... as of now."

The floodgates began to break open with that bit of arrogance.

And the tide began to build as masses of Easterners began clamoring at the gates to be let across. The border guards kept phoning for instructions but none were forthcoming. The major worry then was a guard losing his nerve and start firing into the crowds, but peace was the watchword of the day and no one died.

(Tac, tac, here comes the second domino to fall before the call for freedom.)

Harald Jäger, the commander that night, his own account..

At first there were just a handful of East German citizens there, but by the minute there were more. It went from hundreds to thousands, who chanted, Open the gate!, explained Jäger, who was in charge of 30 guards and three border posts that night."

We stood just an arms-length away from the masses, who were separated from us by just a closed crossing gate, he said, explaining how he was scared of a mass panic. We no longer had the situation under control, said Jäger, now 66 years old. He kept trying to phone his superiors for orders. But higher up, chaos reigned just as it did for us.

Around 9:40 pm, the order came to allow especially provocative citizens through the border, but not to let them back in. But this ventilation tactic didnt help.

At 11:20 pm, I then ordered the crossing gate to be opened and to allow everyone to leave without inspecting their papers, said Jäger. About 25,000 people used their new freedom on that evening to cross into West Berlin."

(Tac, tac, tac, tac..)

I stayed up 20 hours solid watching the events happen, both at home and at school. Nothing got done by anyone during that time, save for basic stuff and getting food.

Where were YOU when the wall fell?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:13 AM

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20 years ago, my god, am i bad on time.. and the 9th. nt

by NIghthawke



Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:15 AM

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wow

by IDN

I was living in Wasilla Alaska at the time, building tree-houses.
I remember people being sprayed down by hoses, as they sort of danced on top.
I remember feeling happy for them, nobody was getting killed I don't think.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 10:22 AM

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I was celebrating my b-day....

by Movie Guy

As usual.

The fall of the wall is probably one of the more over-looked moments of the last quarter century. When I was a junior in college I had a history professor that made a point about dates & times and what we really find important.

He covered everything from the OJ trial, to Pearl Harbor, to VJ day. I'm glad to say, I was the only one who knew the exact date & year the wall fell (in a class of 40).

MG

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:20 PM

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Re: Nov. 7th, when it all happened at The Wall

by CF

Don't recall -- however, at the time I was
taking German in HS (in anticipation of ending
my days in West Germany, facing East, while several
million Baryshnikovs in itchy woolen uniforms
descended upon my location -- damn it...).

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 10:14 PM

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The Wall

by Radical

I was sitting in my room on Downs Barracks about 15 miles from the Inter-German Border, getting drunk during a pre-birthday party. The Charge of quarters came in told us to quit drinking because the wall was falling and nobody knew how the Russians, to include the Eighth Guards Army, our cross border neighbors, were going to react. We turned on the TV, capped the bottles and watched our reason for existence as a unit disappear.
SSG Steve Mason
B Troop 1st Squadron, 11th ACR
Ironhorse

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 6:07 AM

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Glutton. For. Punishment.

by

(deep breath)
A project that's related to my other project that's not quite on topic but since it's a project and I tinker on it and this one will definitely be related to the other one...

There's a tower ya see. (shrugs) What was I supposed to do?

So, ya'll (technical Texas term) may know I own a house with a tower on it...since I go on and on about it here.

A pic (because I can muhahahahaha):
[linked image]

A circa 1903(ish) Queen Anne Victorian. We've had it a year this December 1. Lots 'O things going on. New electric. New plumbing (started). Rebuilding an old second kitchen that was an old screened-in-porch that was an old step-off-porch into a new utility room. One of 47 windows rebuilt.

Heat. Air.

It's going...maybe a little slower than I hoped, but it's progressing nicely.

Now...to the title of this post...

Apparently...I am a glutton for punishment.

Hmmm. Make that Glutton. For. Punishment.

We just put a contract on a 1880(ish) commercial building right on the historic square. With any luck we'll be closing on it about Dec 1 this year.

It has a tower, ya see. How could I resist?

Old house. Tower. Needs a little work.

Building. Tower. Needs a little work.

Seemed to make sense at the time...

I have a squewed definition of the phrase "little work".

Lots more work to do now. We have big plans for this place.

A pic (or couple):
[linked image]

[linked image]

A few more pics here.

More after we close the sale!

CUAgain,
Daniel Meyer (got the evil lair/well on my way to world domination)

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:53 AM

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Sweet! You can offer "loft" apartments!

by Dulie

Great for those first-year teachers coming into town, and for people who are looking for that "charm" of living on main street.

Just an idea.

And I have no idea about if you have the same influx we've got here with people paying way too much for apartments without decent access, light, and ventilation just because it's close to downtown. At least it cleans up the downtown area compared to the squatters who used to be there.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 8:20 AM

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That's one possibility

by

There might even be economic dev funds available for that purpose.

-dm

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:17 AM

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re

by

a lot of law firms and cpa like small main street rooms.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:46 AM

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And the first thing that flashed through my head...

by

Oh (Sugar!) - Unreinforced Masonry construction, and I don't see any of the retrofit bolts and square-plate washers where they bolt through the walls and use back-to-back Simpson brackets to tie them to the floor and roof joists. Tends to keep buildings upright when nature gets nasty.

Yes, I realize you don't get many earthquakes back there, but it only takes one. And it helps for tornadoes too. If you do any heavy retro/repair work, you might want to stick that on the list.

Oh, and I love the surface mount electric service headed to the 2nd floor, with the white water-pipe 45 ells on the conduit. That's slick custom work.

Is the ground floor leased, or vacant?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 8:36 AM

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Re: And the first thing that flashed through my head...

by

Oh (Sugar!) - Unreinforced Masonry construction, and I don't see any of the retrofit bolts and square-plate washers where they bolt through the walls and use back-to-back Simpson brackets to tie them to the floor and roof joists. Tends to keep buildings upright when nature gets nasty.

There are some...they are under the stucco. Probably not enough but the walls are over 18" thick. I figured the bolts were more to hold the second floor beams (10" x 24" timbers) and roof joists in place. The main structural problem with these buildings (in this area and of this era) is the old lime morter tends to have turned to sand after a 100 years or so. Most have been shot with stucco to solve/seal this issue.

Yes, I realize you don't get many earthquakes back there, but it only takes one. And it helps for tornadoes too. If you do any heavy retro/repair work, you might want to stick that on the list.

For the most part, it's fire that gets these buildings. The tornados tend not to damage these or destroy them (and the rest of the immediate area) utterly. Any reinforcement at that point just becomes a projectile or something left to clean up. We will be closely watching and will add anything appropriate. We'd like the thing to last another 100 years at least.


Oh, and I love the surface mount electric service headed to the 2nd floor, with the white water-pipe 45 ells on the conduit. That's slick custom work.

Yep, I noticed that too. Funny thing is, since they are on the fused (breakers) side of the service, it would be legal if they painted the fittings. Because they are not 90's they meet the bend radius requirement but they are they are not the required UV resistant conduit. Would have been a lot easier to pull the wire if they'd have just used the correct fittings. I'd have probably run it in EMT and bent the pipe to order or gone in below the cast-iron line witn an LB and headed upstairs inside.

Usually though...you find..."interesting"...reasons why things are routed as they in these old structures.


Is the ground floor leased, or vacant?

Was operational until this month. They just moved to a new building. So...vacant but usable. The upstairs hasn't been used in decades for anything but storage.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:16 AM

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Re: And the first thing that flashed through my head...

by Anonymous Coward

>>Oh (Sugar!) - Unreinforced Masonry construction, and I don't see any of the retrofit bolts
>>and square-plate washers where they bolt through the walls and use back-to-back Simpson brackets
>>to tie them to the floor and roof joists. Tends to keep buildings upright when nature gets nasty.
>
>There are some...they are under the stucco. Probably not enough but the walls are over 18" thick.
>I figured the bolts were more to hold the second floor beams (10" x 24" timbers) and roof joists
>in place.

Oh, okay. Just as long as you are aware of the potential problem...

> The main structural problem with these buildings (in this area and of this era) is the
>old lime morter tends to have turned to sand after a 100 years or so. Most have been shot with
>stucco to solve/seal this issue.

That's not a solution and we both know it, just a band-aid that hides the problem as it gets worse and worse...

Unfortunately, solving it requires a lot of hand work digging out the rotten lime mortar on the exterior side with chisels, and tuck-pointing it with fresh Portland or Plastic Concrete mortar. And then you have to either seal the exposed bricks & mortar and keep it sealed every few years, or add a proper moisture barrier system and put the Stucco back on to keep the weather out.

Los Angeles doesn't have many of those buildings left to worry about - the 1933 Long Beach quake did a really good job of that, 1971 Sylmar did a touchup, and they keep ratcheting up the Building Codes as they find out what doesn't work. The hard way.

There are a few left up here in the Valley (One at Sherman Way and Reseda Blvd. in Reseda, SW corner), but they have been bolted and should stay together long enough for everyone to get out.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:39 AM

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Just curious....

by Movie Guy

What part of the country is this?

RB

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:23 PM

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Re: Just curious....

by

Northeast Texas.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:48 PM

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TWB: Appropriate name

by McClaw

So what will the ladies' room become?


Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:16 AM

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Re: TWB: Appropriate name

by lawl

Did I just imagine the mythbusters cameo? Or am I getting this comic confused with commander kitty?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:49 AM

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Re: TWB: Appropriate name

by Lord_Chaos

Saw the cameo too. Went to show a friend and it was gone.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 4:53 AM

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Ditto! maybe doc got his first C&D (hope thats a real acronym) N/T

by FireFrenzy

I once did a Jamie Hyneman impression with a ctulthu handpuppet:)

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:10 AM

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Nah...

by

While the "Mythbusters" version was the first idea, it ended up too overdone. 'Course Jinx was a last-minute addition, too, but once I posted it, it kinda struck me as overworking the joke.

That made me realize the base gag worked just fine on it's own (and hey, it's been like five years since I used the gag... happy.gif )

I liked the simpler version better, so I posted that, and linked the MB version. I also altered last Friday's background joke to make it a little more clear what Swamps meant by "ate". happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:00 AM

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"altered last Friday's background joke" - thats tooo bad... [nt]

by IDN

sad.gif

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 3:53 PM

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you mean?

by Anonymous Coward

[linked image]

the link is still there for me

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:19 AM

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Cameo is still there too

by Dulie

for me...

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 8:14 AM

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Love it!

by

Loved both versions!

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:38 AM

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PA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!! (n/t)

by The J.A.M.



Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 8:01 AM

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he he

by IDN

Women's / "garden"?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 10:01 AM

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Powder room

by Nighthawke

Adam will agree with that name, since it has a double meaning.

Powder as in powder thy nose....

And powder as in GUNpowder.


AS if that needed to be told...


Yes, hook up the charges, just be ready to run like the wind tho....

Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 5:51 AM

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No, the next joke's going to be on his coffee mug: "What's Ursine?" N/T

by Anon E. Mouse



Posted on Nov 10, 2009, 1:07 PM

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Spark plug repair in an aluminum head?

by Hans

I'm planning on repairing a couple long-time suspect spark plug holes in my Land Rover, when spring rolls around.

Anybody have experience with any of the existing kits out there from places like Full-Torque or Timesert? I don't mind spending extra for the right insert kit, but I'd rather not pull the heads AGAIN until it's time to rebuild the engine in a few years.

I've also seen a lot of talk one way or the other about material. The steel and the aluminum guys always saying that the other kind is bad. Who to believe?

-Hans

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 4:13 AM

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I have used a steel insert kit with success

by Redwing

I used a kit with a steel insert on my brother's Subaru (aluminum head) several months ago, so far so good.
The instructions recommend removing the head (of course) but I simply made sure both valves were closed, ran the tap in dry (important so the chips don't stick to anything in the cylinder), and stuck a long homemade air nozzle in there until nothing but air came out. Once I was satisfied all the chips were blown out, I coated the insert with Loctite 272 and installed it using the spark plug.
Here's a couple of links:

http://www.toolfetch.com/p-kd2123.shtml
http://www.toolfetch.com/p-kd2128.shtml


Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 9:36 AM

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The kit/inserts I use come from NAPA....

by

If you have a good NAPA store near you, go look at the different kits. They have different kits/inserts for your type plug/head.

Personally I use lots of lard on the tap. Chips embed in the lard. After blowing out the hole good, I shoot some brakekleen in and blow it dry.

I've done many over the years and all have been successful.

Lee


Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 3:29 PM

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Another trick

by Renegade_Azzy

When I was retapping the heads on a CB650 for helicoils, someone here suggested using a drinking straw and my hand or duct tape to attach it to the end of a shop vac. Worked like a charm to ger chips out of where they should not stay.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:43 AM

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Only one I've done...

by

... Was a homebrew job on a single-cylinder 2-stroke bike engine. Simple head, basically just a cap with a hole in the center and a water jacket. I bored the old hole out and tapped it to... whatever size worked out. Probably something like 3/4" fine, maybe.

Turned a plug from a chunk of 3/4" 6061 roundbar and cranked it in there with some red LocTite, and after it cured, just sawed it off. Bored a new hole, used a "thread restorer" as a tap (Dremelled two new cutting grooves in it) and trimmed up the excess.

Worked great, and last I heard the bike was still running fine.

Don't have any personal experience with any of the automotive repair kits, so I can't say. I will say I've used neversieze on 'plug threads since at least high school, so I haven't run across too many.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 11:49 PM

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These were cross threaded.....

by Hans

I knew there was a problem when I first went to take the plugs out, and saw that one was visibly at a wrong angle. The other problem plug I discovered later when it only partially threaded into the head.

-Hans

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:34 AM

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I repaired an aluminum Z50 head once with a steel coil kit.

by Z50

the bike is no longer running but the engine still runs fine.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:14 AM

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TWB: Snowshoe and Tawny

by CF

1) Where are they?

2) Does the answer to #1 involve a carriage
and a minivan? happy.gif

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 10:21 PM

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They hold the TWB camera and mic.

by Anonymous Coward

A good cameraman never shows himself.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 1:15 PM

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Re: They hold the TWB camera and mic.

by CF

If Harold from The Red Green Show can remotely
operate the cameras and FX for the show while on
camera, I don't see why Doc couldn't rig something
for them to use.

Unless, of course, his rigging skills are being
put to other uses.... >wink.gif

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 10:43 PM

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they were eaten -

by IDN

by Bruno

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 1:17 PM

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Re: TWB: Snowshoe and Tawny

by Snowshoe

[linked image]

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 1:22 AM

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Old Sterling Air fitting threads.

by oldironmudder

I picked up an older Sterling from a fella across the pond. Ive tried calling the guy from Arrow over here in the USA but he isnt any help. Went to the machine shop & got a crappy answer. "1/4- twenty something should work, just wrap the hell out of it with teflon tape" Thats not going to cut it so I went to the auto parts store where I always go & asked the owner. He has a 1/8-28 brittish tap but could not find it & said he is about 98% sure thats what it is. He can get an adapter to 1/8-27 npt but I dont want to spend $5 on a fitting & $8 for shipping for something Im still not sure about.

So, if anyone knows or can point me toward someone or a place that can tell me, please do.

James

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 6:20 PM

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Maybe I can help

by

Shoot me an email with an exact description of everything - pictures will also be welcome. I'll forward it to either to the engineer or one of the tech guys to get you the answer you need.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 7:27 AM

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dropped piece of bread almost cause a big boom

by

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/Large-Hadron-Collider-LHC-bread,news-5047.html

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 4:19 PM

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Kinda surprising...

by Andrew

I'm a little surprised such a critical component was left so vulnerable.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 7:29 PM

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The dump caverns

by

"The dump caverns are large, artificial caves, which would channel the power into a "dump core." The core is a 7m-long graphite block encased in steel, water cooled and then further wrapped in 750 tonnes of concrete and iron shielding. According to Lamont, the dump core would become extremely hot and quite radioactive, but with massive amounts of shielding and a huge amount of solid granite between the dump caverns and the surface, " Nobody up top, except the control room staff, would even notice."

If there were no dump caverns? LHC's niobium-titanium magnets are likely to cease superconducting at around 9.6 Kelvin. When circulating, each of the two beams of hadrons pack enormous amounts of power and if they were to suddenly stop, all the energy would have to go somewhere. The Reg equates the damage to being rammed by an aircraft carrier."

Seriously - birds? What happens if it rains?!

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 7:32 PM

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It's actually indoors

by Tippmann1

well underground actually. quite a bit underground really. birds getting in there doesn't really surprise me all that much. I mean we're talking about a tunnel thats 17 miles long and is the height of an airplane hanger in some places. not to mention doors big enough to truck in MASSIVE parts of the LHC spread throughout the tunnel. The likelihood that they could keep out birds and other small animals is extremely small. I'd probably even guess they employ someone who's job it is just to round up animals that have snuck in.

rain on the other hand has probably been thought out.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 10:18 PM

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Indeed, I've seen birds loose in a sealed clean room.

by CRySyS

I helped build Samsungs newest microchip fab in Austin and during construction, after the clean room had been sealed up and particle counts were being lowered birds would find their way into the ballroom. At least 4 that I remember made it in. It was pretty funny watching teams that obviously had not been prepared for this trying to chase a bird around a football field sized room with brand new fishing nets strapped to poles.

Birds suck.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 7:17 PM

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That is hilarious.

by Z50

What else do you know of that is "over heated" at 8K?

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:19 AM

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I don't know why, but I really like this Goblin Launcher.

by baldusi

Please see: www.goblinpaintball.com
I think about building a true shotgun simulator or simply as a device when playing traitor. Never to mention, the dueling posibilities of this!

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 2:39 PM

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This is foder for a Hellboy sixshooter variant. N/T

by Karpet

Nuked Tacos

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 10:15 PM

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It be cool to see a girl pull off Meryl Stryfe at a scenario.

by ta2maki

Not sure if anyone would want to throw around a few thousand dollars in markers.
[linked image]

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:18 AM

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only need... 50 of them plus custom greatcloak and holster strips

by

89.99 per, figure $5000 for costume and markers, plus labor and and paint time. all to equal the output of a short A5 with a 50 round tac cap on it, and in a heavier package.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 2:29 PM

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The first of many daily grinds...

by

I actually had a project in need of a surface grinder (that I could have done other ways, but using an actual grinder will just make it better) so I just couldn't stand it. I robbed the VFD out of the Logan (which I'd just installed, but will be removing temporarily to swap the motor again) and hooked it temporarily to the grinder.

The spindle spins up nicely, and after a quick dress, the wheel that came on it turns smoothly and quietly. Still no vacuum or coolant, but it's usable.

'Course, before I jump right in to cut a payin' job, I probably ought to get a bit of practice in first. happy.gif

This is one of the old jaw inserts from my first Kurt-clone "Elephant" mill vise. No idea what alloy they are- or even material, they could be cast iron- but they're very hard. I've ruined a couple of endmills over the years accidentally running them into the jaw.

[linked image]

I also knew from past experience that the jaws were "dished" slightly, occasionally making indicating things kind of iffy. Now, I've long since replaced 'em with some soft jaws, but these are still perfect test pieces for a quick grind. Long, flat, low, good metal (at least hard, anyway) already pretty smooth...

I put some red marker on it to see the progress better.

[linked image]

The hand feed can be tedious, but it's not too bad.

[linked image]

Yep, it's just a tad warped.

And in this case, "a tad" isn't a gag line- the difference between the high spots and the lows was less than 0.002". My first "cut" was half a thou.

[linked image]

You can see how it's flattening out very faint grooves from the original machining- grooves that make me think the jaws were originally made on a shaper, since another grinder wouldn't have made grooves like that, and any rotary cutter would have left swirls.

[linked image]

After a couple more passes, totalling about two thou plus a tenth clean-up pass, it's pretty smooth. The photos always make it look "rougher" than it is- the surface is actually smooth enough it "wrings" to my surface plate.

[linked image]

The other side gave me this interesting pattern for the first pass. Again, the difference is less than a thou- "flat" ain't necessarily flat. happy.gif

[linked image]

Hard to photograph it properly, but it's a very nice finish.

'Course, it came out so well, I started grinding everything in sight. happy.gif

[linked image]

This is the bottom of an old shop-made V-block I aquired a year or two ago. Nicely made, but it's had some poor handling so it was covered in nicks and dings that were too hard to file and too large, in most cases, to stone off. I ground everything but the Vee- and I'll do that as soon as I make a fence for the chuck and my magnetic V-blocks get here.

[linked image]

Another quickie was this sine bar I got at a garage sale a few years back. It'd been stored poorly and was rusty- I'd stoned most of the rust off so it was at least smooth, but it was still tarnished.

[linked image]

A few quick passes and it, too, is now flat and smooth and looks new. (At least on the sides. happy.gif )

[linked image]

More V-block. I might have to grind slots in the sides so I can make a U-clamp.

[linked image]

Last I figured I'd see how the chuck itself is. I think I started out taking less than a thou, probably about .0007, but as you can see, that didn't touch the ends or the near side. This chuck may never have been ground in.

After I have a little more time on it, I'll probably give the chuck another light pass to get full contact- no worries, since it only needs a thou at a time, you could grind this chuck about 200 times before it starts getting thin. happy.gif

I definitely need the vacuum working though...

I have some components for a rotary converter on the way, and a nice pair of 5HP motors with which to build it. Hopefully it'll work.

Doc.





Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 3:29 AM

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Reading tea leaves (or grinder sparks)

by Nighthawke

From the photo of you grinding on that one jaw, it appears to be made of a wrought iron alloy, almost looks like a Muschet steel or a magnesium steel alloy, but the application of the material points to a remarkably tough iron alloy.

Tough stuff to be knocking your inserts silly.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 3:22 PM

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Alloys...

by

I'd wager the closest we'll get to an "alloy" on that particular piece is "cheap Chinese scrap-ladle crap".

It's awfully hard, and the sparks "feather" noticibly indicating a fair carbon content. But the texture inside the drilled countersinks almost suggests cast. (Or a really dull drill bit.)

The jaws on the newest two 4" mill vises are almost certainly scraps of cast iron. Maybe it's cheaper than bar stock, or something.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 7:13 PM

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I may want to send you a couple small pieces to clean up....

by Hans

My Mossberg firing pins are stamped from flat steel, and could use a good cleaning up. I may want to send them up for a could quick passes through the machine to make all smooth and shiny as opposed to the horrid current condition.

-Hans

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 4:28 AM

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As long as...

by

... You're sure they won't be too thin.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 12:02 AM

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I've got a spare :-)

by Hans

So it's not a significant concern. If anything, too thin might be better as it might finally make the thing work.

-Hans

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 3:31 AM

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I am surprised Doc, for you to make that mistake.

by MephitMark

No, I am not going to go over board here, and yes I know that I am not in your skill level Doc. But I do remember from my school days that if you do anything to the magnetic chuck on a surface grinder, that you must first re-grind the chuck to ensure it is "squared" to the wheel and all. Though I doubt that the parts that you have ground prior to grind the chuck will be all that out of square and all. But still there is the chance things are not quite what you had thought they'd be.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 7:48 PM

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Mistake...?

by

I quite intentionally didn't grind the chuck right away.

First off, because I'd already run an indicator over it, both to check the condition of the table and the chuck itself, and to come reasonably close to squaring it to the table travel.

That showed the chuck was only very slightly out- I got slight and often vague readings on an .001" indicator, confounded somewhat by the various nicks and dings in the surface. (Which I'd already hand-stoned down, but still left slight pits.)

I probably should have used an .0001 "last word" but the surface was rough I knew I was going to grind it in eventually anyway.

Secondly, everything I've ground so far is just for fun. As yet, I'm not worried about grinding to tolerance or even to dimension, and not even particularly worried about squareness. I'm grinding noncritical stuff just to get used to the machine.

While I'm by no means anything close to an expert at this yet, I'm also not a complete noob. And all of my hands-on use so far has been with fully-automatic models where all I have to do is stand there and be mesmerized by the backy-forthy sparky-sparky.

I carefully stoned and indicated the table before mounting the chuck, which was itself stoned and indicated. Both the table and the bottom of the chuck were sprayed with LPS-3 to help protect it against the eventual coolant, and it was allowed to bleed out and dry a bit before the hold-downs were fully tightened.

And thirdly, while the chuck does, as I said, have more than enough meat for plenty of additional clean-up grinds, that doesn't mean I should scrape the top off willy-nilly whenever I feel like it.

Grinding something as large as a 6x18" mag-chuck is not a trivial exercise, between possible heat build-up, wheel wear, bed-roller lube and so on. It's a trick for even an experienced user with a properly-selected wheel to get a proper grind on a piece as big as a full chuck.

And so far I've got one day under my belt, the wheel that came in the machine (which appears to run true but has a slight chip in one edge) a dull dresser, and no coolant or vacuum.

I'm gonna play around a little more, make a back rail/fence for the chuck, and wait 'til I can get more hubs and wheels in- plus the mag blocks and parallels- before I start trying to do "real work" with it.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 11:37 PM

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Hmmm, I was wondering about the first grindings.

by MephitMark

I had suspected that you were trying the grinder out first time around. Though my MTTP instructors would raise an eye brow about your methodology.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 1:13 AM

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Screw methodology...

by

As I said, I'm not a complete noob. I have no fewer than six books that have some pretty good information on surface grinders, including two textbooks that have literal "step by step" instructions for various techniques.

Trust me when I say that, since the day I bought this thing, I've absorbed and reabsorbed every word, plus spent a few spare minutes poring over old posts on PM and HSM.

I don't have the benefit of a local instructor or a shop foreman, but I do have the understanding that this is my machine, that I bought and paid for and personally hand-assembled. Like any of my other machines, I'm going to try like hell to not crash anything, break anything or bend anything.

Before I ever cranked a handle on this machine, I knew how to dress the wheel, how to touch off the part, how much or how little I could safely take off, how far I could advance the cut the "stepover") how the lube and oil systems worked, the rough holding power of the magnet and a pretty good idea of what kind of additional wheels I'll need (or want.)

That vise jaw is literally the first object I'd ever ground using this machine- or any manual machine- and only the fourth or fifth object I'd ever surface ground, period. But despite that, I got a very acceptable surface, had no burns or chatter, and according to the Last Word on the surface plate, is within .0002 or .0003 of having both sides parallel.

And that was before I ground the chuck.

I plan to eventually grind that jaw and the as-yet untouched one again, this time with an eye towards shooting for an actual (albeit arbitrary) dimension, and making sure both are as close to absolutely square as possible.

Like every other machine, it'll take practice to get good at it, and I'll have to make some mistakes and do a lot more reading before I can call myself comfortable with it.

But no matter what, I'm damn glad I got it, and happy with how it turned out. (It could, for example, have easily had smoked spindle bearings- $$$!- or damaged ball ways. And even very slight damage to the ball ways would have caused all sorts of problems...)

Doc.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 1:45 AM

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try this at home...

by ydna

I didn't realize you never did much grinding in your spare time. Must be pretty cool to get a machine like that and shine up everything in sight happy.gif

Here's something I've been experimenting with recently, see if you can try it out sometime. The question is what's the quickest way to remove a huge chunk of material while grinding. Say you had one of those small combination blocks and there was a large mark on one of the thinner ends. You stand it up and prepare to rigidly remove a huge amount of material before you're clear of the dent, say you had to remove 0.1 height total before it's smooth like you need.

Whenever I've done this in the past I went at it the traditional way, by choosing a good step-down amount like 5 thou (given the workpiece is being smashed in by surrounding magnetic items, not too rigid) and waving back and forth across the top of the block like normal. Takes forever! Recently I heard somebody suggest something different so I tried it out...instead of stepping back and forth, just center the block under the wheel (Y) and grind the ENTIRE surface at once, full thickness of the wheel or close to it, but obviously when you do this you can only remove 0.0001-0.0002 per pass.

It blows the wheel dressing to shit, so you have to re-dress before the final passes, but again the question is does it end up being faster by removing full-thickness passes every one-tenth, or by stepping across the part in Y and removing a little over 5 thou when you get done with the single layer.

I timed myself both methods and found the full-thickness method to seem much faster, though the actual numbers said it was only a few seconds faster to achieve the same results as the traditional grinding method. I haven't had the chance to try it again, since the parameters change depending on how the part is clamped, etc. but it might get your mind working in the meantime...

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 6:48 AM

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As good as I am, I now full well who's the better machinist here.

by MephitMark

And that is you Nickels. As I have said before, why I pay close attention to your thoughts and opinions. Especially when you do acknowledge that you can and do make mistakes. Hopefully I'll post else where about some of my recent 'learning' experiences. You'll get a great laugh out of them.

I do envy greatly the set-up you have. As simple as you have it is, it still beats out most of us. That and you do have a good clientele for an income.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:07 AM

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UNF Thread Profile

by

Ok, I'm trying to model some threads here and I'm banging my head against the wall because They don't seem to be coming out right.

I'm cutting an external 1/2-20 UNF thread. The sketch that's making the swept cut is basically a 60* eqlat triangle.

My one side is the pitch, 1/20" or .05"
Opposite that I have a flat 1/8 the pitch, (about 6 thou)
And the flats on either side to break the peak is half that, (about 3 thou)

Where I'm hung up is figuring what to do with the major diameter.

Every profile sketch I find on Google shows me the thread height. But all the thread tables consistently show me is major diameter!

So is the major diameter the actual diameter of the screw? Or is it the diameter of the basic triangle, or the dia of a clearance hole?




Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:31 PM

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major/minor diameter

by ustilago

Major diameter is the diameter across the peaks, Minor diameter, across the valleys. . .

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 9:09 PM

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Thread form

by

Major diameter of the external thread is the nominal diameter minus the thread_height/8, minor diameter is nominal plus thread_height/4. Internal threads have the truncations reversed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ISO_and_UTS_Thread_Dimensions.svg

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 6:18 AM

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Total Ebay Hysteria..bought a Promaster

by RA

Man am I going to hate myself in the morning? Bought a used ICD Promaster.

Looked pretty decent in the pics. Came with a mega drop forward, $120 something shipped.

I always wanted one but didn't think about how tough it will be to get parts to maintain it. Yea I'm looking for comfort here!!!!

R

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:11 PM

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Same here. Got me a pretty good SB 9" bed for about $200 shipped...(NT)

by

No turning yet...

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 5:38 PM

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all hope is lost turn back....

by

i bought one two years ago as an xmss gift. the bolts and bolt pins are easy to find or make.. the only hard part would be to rewire the marker if the stock board went south and you try and replace it with a 3 party board. the only part i would stock up on is valve and stock springs.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:11 PM

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Where to get parts?

by RA

Man I'm not seeing too many parts on the web????

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 4:50 PM

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You are the man.

by Gunslinger

hey i just bought a well upgraded promaster for 98 bucks. man i love that thing. feels like sheer beauty in my hands. I'm glad to see you took my advice. and don't worry, they are not that hard to get parts for.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 11:06 PM

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Not Upgraded

by RA

No upgrades on mine. I wonder if I over paid? Oh well maybe I'll love it.

I've read that the Promaster doesn't work well with a HP tank. Man I hope that's not true. I'm not buying another tank.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 4:49 PM

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Mine didn't work well with anything...

by

HPA... paintballs...
Shoot its internals didn't even cooperate with each other!

I hope you have better luck

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 7:41 PM

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mine seems to work pretty well

by Gunslinger

hooked up my throttle to it earlier and fired off some shots. seemed to run fairly smooth. i'm running an untuned ninja reg on my tank, but i can't remember if that means it's set to high or low..but it cycled well enough for me. also, depending on what tank you are using, i might recommend just switching tank regs if things don't work out. my ninja is adjustable from low to high output and cost me $35 for a 4500 reg straight from Ninja.

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 8:37 PM

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Jerry Olny of the Misfits is a Machinest?

by

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEhJAl7gLss

At about 8 minutes in he talks about owning a large machine shop, and having to close it due to Chinese machining.

Cool stuff

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 1:44 PM

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It is sad.

by MephitMark

Where once this nation was the greatest in power from manufacturing. Where now the only thing we seem to be great at is making the illusions of great deeds.


Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 8:43 PM

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2 x 2 = no hydro?

by LGND

Hey, can anybody point me in the right direction on this one?

I have 2 fairly new 9oz tanks that my local field has decided not to fill because the label (Pure Energy?) says to re-hydro by mm/yy (couple months past at this point).

Now here's where I could use some help. Is there an exemption for tanks under 2" diameter and 2' long? I've always heard there was but I'm not sure where to look.

At this point re-hydroing would just be silly, I could simply buy new for the same price & less hassel, but of course ideally I'd just keep on using these tanks. I could understand if a field didn't want to fill them because they were old/beat, but I think I've only had them a year or two and rarely used them (just when I wanted to pull out the VM's)

Thanks - LGND

ps links to official documents would be awesome

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 12:35 PM

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Here you go, right from the DOT

by Pump Scout

I'd e-mailed them on this issue back in 2003, and saved the response for such questions. happy.gif

Ben
**************

Dear Ben,

We have received your inquiry about the Hazardous Materials Regulations
(HMR; 49 CFR Parts 171-180). The HMR are available at the following URL:

http://hazmat.dot.gov/rules.htm

Periodic requalification of DOT specification cylinders is specified in §
180.209. Any cylinder not exceeding 2 inches in outside diameter is not
subject to the volumetric expansion test.

If you require further assistance, our Hazardous Materials Information
Center is staffed with regulatory specialists who can quickly answer your
questions by phone. Please do not hesitate to call, as the Information
Center is open Monday through Friday, 9 am - 5 pm E.S.T. at (800) 467-4922
or (202) 366-4488.

Sincerely,

Kurt Eichenlaub, Hazardous Materials Specialist



Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 1:01 PM

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wow

by LGND

Not that I doubted the collective resources of the guild...

...but wow, that was super quick for a friday afternoon!

Thanks!

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 1:09 PM

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only for 1800 psi AL tanks and it must have....

by B

the DOT exception code on it if it does not it is not exempt any tank older than 88 has no code.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 3:39 PM

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Still, they can refuse your tank for any reason.

by ta2maki

It's up to the fill operator to determine whether or not a specific can is safe to fill. You can try to let them know the facts, but ultimately it's their call.



Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 3:42 PM

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Seconded...

by

Because once the steel tanks get rust of 'em, they usually won't touch them...

Although, the refill by exchange places might...(Acetylene bottles kinda do that)

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- has some fishy looking steel tanks that he might have hydro'd or make wind chimes from happy.gif

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 5:43 PM

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Walmart

by

Not sure if they still offer it but Walmart did offer a trade in program for paintball tanks.

Just like propane just bring in old one get new filled one. It's been awhile since I looked though.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 7:23 PM

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Blue Rhino program

by Pump Scout

They had it, and may still have it in some areas. The ones around me, central Wisconsin, don't. I think some other stores were doing it for a short time, too, but I haven't seen any in quite a while. YMMV.

Ben

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 12:00 PM

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Lowes

by

Lowes stores sell a Co2 tank for air tools. They have an exchange program like that for Blue Rhino propane tanks. Not sure if they are the same kind of tanks you need, but they sound like they are of a similar size.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:08 AM

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TWB: I like the renaissance of the classic topics.

by Z50

Sometimes it is good to get away from the ridiculously long plot lines.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 6:36 AM

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I agree =)

by

Should be fun to see some of the old gags again.

...But I'm also wondering how long we'll be in the dark about That night at Howie's... happy.gif

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 6:39 AM

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TWB 2009-11-06

by IDN

First thing I saw was the "Fzownt!" Then saw Roger 'n Swamps small, I thought they had been shrunk.

Nice sound affects by the way, even if that might be a standard (I wouldn't know).

I wonder, is that the manager Docs talking to. Or is it a teen with a cracking voice.
Also what fast food manager has time to coordinate Teleportative food attacks!?

heh, blue.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:49 AM

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Explanation, he he =)

by Anonymous Coward

http://www.the-whiteboard.com/autowb026.html This is the first appearance of the pizza teleporter happy.gif

I you like what you see Blue I definitely recommend reading ALL of the back strips, well worth it.

Black Spot



Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:19 PM

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One who's a techie on the side. ;> .........n/t

by Ketira

wink.gif

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 2:09 AM

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Ea? I don't get it. NT

by



Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 9:10 AM

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It took me a couple of seconds to get the joke panel 1

by PhantomFox

Thought process:
"Well, he's holding a cup, that could be a blue slurpie. Those get your tongue nice and blue. Doesn't seem right though. What else could he have done. Last we saw him...
...
He couldn't mean... yes. Yes he does mean it. *snigger*"

Could we say that joke is in questionable taste? wink.gif /rimshot

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 10:52 AM

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oh my god

by IDN

oh ... my ... god... PhantomFox now that you illuminated the joke to me, I was in a state of extreme disbelief(kinda grossed out) and explosive laughter. I kept the laughter inside and nearly exploded.

DocN almost killed me. My minds never in that frame of comedy when reading TWB.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 5:06 PM

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i don't get

by Anonymous Coward

the blue joke

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 9:37 PM

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I imagine Sandy's costume...

by PhantomFox

...had some blue dye involved, given the character she was dressed up as (Krystal from the StarFox series) was a blue vixen. Now figure out how that got on Swampy's tongue. If you still can't get the joke, wait until you're older.

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 12:00 PM

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OT: And if that don't work... use more gun

by Flagada


First of all: Never played this game so I have no idea if it's any good

I stumbled across an clip of 'The Orange Box' which is a collection of games including this one. What got me was the TF part of this clip. Some character with a fireaxe looked menacing one second, the flipped it around and started playing air-guitar on it... Ok, here's a game that doesn't take itself too seriously happy.gif So I googled for more clips. There's several on their site but to me only two are realy good. Best one (imho) is 'The Engineer'. Oh, and if you decide to check it out... keep an eye on the 'kill counter' . I like it when they put a lot of detail in.

http://www.teamfortress.com/engineer.htm

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 6:31 AM

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I tihnk the meet the spy is the best.

by WhiteFeather

http://www.teamfortress.com/spy.htm

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 7:08 AM

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funny

by IDN

I waited soooooooooo long for TF2 that I didn't care when it finally came out looooong after HL2.
I saw a screen shot of big CARTOON CHARACTERS! and thought, nope, Im not playing cartoons.

But good clip.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:55 AM

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Yea, Team Fortress 2

by darklynx

TF2 alone is worth the price of admission, portal and episode 2 are icing on the cake. Best 20 bucks you can spend!

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 10:13 AM

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Very great game

by

Haven't played it in awhile, but it is a GREAT game, currently off TF2 and hooked on Borderlands (another phenominal game) and Portal was a fun puzzle game, seems like something the folks here would enjoy.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:15 PM

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I have never played Half Life, or any other Valve game...

by icouldbeahero

But I love their videos (see the Portal one as well) and I avidly follow(ed) some fan-created content like Concerned http://hlcomic.com/) and the Freeman's Mind videos on youtube.

Some day, maybe I will have time...

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 3:49 AM

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TWB: Wednesday's is still there.

by Ketira

DocN, you forget to upload today's strip or what?


...........just curious.....

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:09 AM

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Re: TWB: Wednesday's is still there.

by Retromash

Patience. He has more important things to do often enough.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:21 AM

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Re: TWB: Wednesday's is still there.

by CTPatt

Also, he's in a later time zone than most of us. Alaska, remember?

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:28 AM

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I think that Wednesday's strip looks better without words.

by Der Alta

[linked image]

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:59 AM

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What the HELL do you think you are doing Ketira!

by IDN

Dont look DocN in the eyes!
Dont ask (getting off the couch) favours!
Dont pet his nose!
Dont hug his fluffy neck
Dont play "catch the meat"!
And Dont Talk directly to him!

This warning issued for the safety of all limbs within the vicinity.

SeverStop Inc.
"We keep you'r limbs intact, when you forget"
A Healthy Limb Co. -

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 9:14 AM

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*Snickers* n/t

by Nighthawke

i told you......

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 12:02 PM

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.....and YOU need to relax.

by Ketira

1. I am like my next eldest brother: I am not afraid to die. It just means I'll have to wait a bit longer for my soulsis to reincarnate.

As for the rest - anything I have asked for of DocN is with everyone in mind. Remember what happened Wednesday? This is America, including Alaska, so I can do as I damn well please.

Besides, (via his character) he's already met Anpu. I don't think he wants to meet that particular Deity again.

So c'mon - relax a little! You boys risk getting bruises when you play paintball, non? I know the risks and am willing to take them here. I'm sure I've made him laugh at least once....

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 2:07 AM

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was joking - hell even wen I'm mad I'm joking [nt]

by IDN

and I don't get mad.
and I forgot to put a smile.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 11:13 AM

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doc shopcat lol

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2807975424

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:15 PM

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pssst

by IDN

pssst - raise the bar wink.gif

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 9:17 AM

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ok how about this...

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2819874816

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 6:55 PM

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lol nade..

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2819967488

Posted on Nov 8, 2009, 7:27 PM

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he he, yea [nt]

by IDN

kitten-nade geh

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 9:53 AM

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sharpie

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2821929984

Posted on Nov 9, 2009, 11:58 AM

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Quick physics question

by

Nothing to do with anything other than a situation which occured to me and puzzled me. I'm by no means a physicist, but I like to understand the world around me.

So here are my underlying assumptions:

- From the perspective of the universe, matter and energy are interchangeable.

- Law of conservation of mass and energy states that mass and energy can be interchanged, however, they can never be increased or reduced.

So let's go completely blue-sky here and say that we are masters of matter/energy, and can convert them back and forth at will with no loss. Not possible from a realistic perspective, but my understanding is that it is possible from a theoretical perspective, yes? So theoretically, you could take a 10-lb block of lead, convert it to light, and convert that light back to a 10-lb block of lead.

My question is --- let's say I made a perfectly straight tunnel with a perfect vacuum inside it and tied it to the space elevator so that one end is on the earth and the other is in orbit. Now, I convert a 10lb block of lead into laser light at one end of the tunnel (on earth), and shoot the light up the tunnel into orbit, where the energy is then converted back to lead. (the tunnel/laser isn't critical, you could also use a superconducting wire and electricity, or whatever).

Now here's the thing - my understanding of the above would violate the law of conservation of matter and energy, so I'm pretty sure it's wrong. It can't be possible that the block of lead would remain 10lbs, because if so, it would have gained potential energy from nowhere. So what am I missing? Given perfect conversion rates and absolutely no loss of energy in transmission, would the mass of the lead be lower? Seems like it would have to be to make up for the "new" potential energy, but why?

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:32 AM

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clarification

by

I said lb in that post, which is weight, not mass - say 10kg.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:32 AM

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Well, you're a bit inconsistent...

by

Basically you're saying "assume there are no losses", and then asking how the process could have no loss.

In the real world, yes, the process is theoretically possible. Actually, it's literally possible, in that we can shoot particles at another material, and convert that element to a different element by forcibly adding electrons.

But, of course, it takes millions of watts to make a few atoms worth of the new element.

Generally speaking, yes- mass is energy, energy is mass, etc. If one could snap the fingers of an Infinity Gauntlet or something, and break the binding of all the atoms in that block of lead, you'd have several megatons of explosive energy in an instant. Heat, light, gamma rays, X-rays, etc. ("Heat", of course, just being a different wavelength of "light", which is itself essentially a lower-energy gamma ray, etc.)

Now, collect all that heat and light in a magic bubble that lets none of it escape. The entire block of lead is still there- every atom. It's just in a different form.

The trick is to reassemble it. You have to take some of the energy from the fast particles (the X and gamma rays) and use that to re-bind the loose electrons and protons back into lead atoms.

And it's far, far easier to release that energy than it is to recapture it. It's easier to pop a balloon than it is to blow it up- or it's easier to burn a gallon of gasoline than it is to make more gas.

Not sure I explained what you had in mind, but it's a start. happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:51 AM

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Say what?

by velociostrich

Now hold up a second -- aren't gamma rays and photons, though both are forms of electromagnetic radiation, different?

And it's the number of protons that determines what element something is, so firing electrons at a given element (or so I understand) wouldn't change what element it was, just the number of electrons it had.

Right?

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 2:15 PM

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electrons define what element it is, protons define what isotope it is? <nt>

by Anonymous Coward

nuclear troubles...(haha, a pun)

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 6:54 PM

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No.

by Anonymous ~Hero~

There are three particles which make up atoms: electrons, protons, and neutrons. Protons sit in the atomic nucleus. Electrons orbit it. And neutrons glue the protons together.

In an electrically neutral atom, the number of electrons and protons is equal. Adding or subtracting electrons causes the atom to become "ionized"; this process is partly responsible for atomic bonds. Salt, or "sodium chloride", when in solution, doesn't exist as molecules of sodium and chlorine; it exists as positive sodium ions and negative chlorine ions.

The number of PROTONS, therefore, defines the element. Any isotope of carbon has 6 protons. Depending on its state, it may have more or less electrons, although in most cases it will have 6 electrons to match the protons.

The number of NEUTRONS defines the isotope. Carbon-12, for example, has 6 neutrons holding its 6 protons together. Carbon-14 has 8 neutrons. Because it has two extra neutrons, C-14 is significantly more unstable than C-12, and will spontaneously decay into nitrogen-14, with a half-life (how long it takes for half of a sample to decay) of about 5700 years.

And that last is useful because the proportion of C-14 to C-12 in an archaeological sample can tell a scientist just how old it is - a process known as radiocarbon dating.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:23 PM

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I suppose there losses depend on where you look...

by

It's going to take a certain amount of work into interchange your block of lead to it's energy equivalent and to reconstitute it when it gets there. So what you gain in the "free" transport is lost in "handling charges"

Besides, I'm not sure that conservation of energy really applies to this situation anyway. Technically speaking, you're moving energy not mass into orbit.

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- hmmph...


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 9:19 PM

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Right - I take his assumption to be "no losses to entropy"

by

In this purely hypothetical situation, sure, let's ignore the 2nd law.

But the "loss" due to the change in gravitational potential energy isn't an entropy loss, it IS actually work done on the subject material.

I think you could NOT get 10kg of lead to reappear in orbit. The laser you start with at the bottom when you convert the lead to light would have a certain frequency, which defines it's quantity of energy. As it goes up, the frequency (and energy) would get lower because gravity is working against it. This is one of the phenomena of black holes, up until light fails to escape. So, a blue laser starting at the bottom would be a little more red at the top, and have less energy, so it would convert to only 9.999999999...kg of lead, even assuming perfect conversion at both ends and no other losses to entropy.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:03 AM

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Ah, and the potential energy....

by

the energy which would be transferred to the Earth once the brick fell back down, would account for the loss in mass of the brick!

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 7:05 AM

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You're forgetting one crucial aspect...

by Andrew

You're forgetting one crucial aspect. You are correct, the new block of lead would had additional potential energy. But you're asking where it comes from and that answer is fairly simple, it comes from the work you have done on the block of lead/light. The work is converted into potential energy in this purely theoretical situation.

The mass would not be lower, as the energy used for transport is independent of the rest energy of the lead.


-Andrew

P.S. I'm pretty sure that addresses your question. But I've been known to misconstrue statements at times.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 12:13 PM

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Not forgetting ... just ...

by

What form does the work take when transporting electricity across a superconductor, or laser light through a vacuum? My understanding is in both cases, working against gravity wouldn't have an impact, would it? Wouldn't the energy at the source of the energy/electricity (earth) be exactly the same as at the end (orbit)?

To address Doc's point, yes, that's true - but my point is that there should be more than that. The energy losses in the process of conversion are all inefficiencies, and would thereby result in the release of other types of energy (heat, light, etc.), reducing mass in an equivelant measure - but that doesn't explain the additional potential energy. I'm guessing there must be even further reduced matter, but that would imply that the "exchange rate" for matter and energy would be different depending on proximity to large masses... which doesn't seem right to me either.

I'm guessing the 'work' explanation is right, I'm just trying to wrap my head around the 'how' - how is work taking place to move energy into orbit?

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 12:44 PM

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The easiest way to think about it...

by Andrew

The work done to transport the electricity would be sourced from the electric field. In fact, calculating the electric work can be done by taking the integral of the electric field with respect to the distance from it multiplied by the charge (I believe it is a line integral). If you still cannot wrap your head around it, then just imagine the lead block is never converted to light, then it is simply mechanical work (F*d).

The energy of the lead when it is elevated would not be the same as if it on the ground because you adding energy to the system when you are lifting it up. The energy used to lift the lead is converted directly to potential energy.

How is work taking place to move energy into orbit? You said it yourself. In theoretical physics, matter and energy are the same thing. A force is applied to move the matter (lead block) or energy (light) over a distance (from surface of earth to orbital radius).

Let me know if this is making sense or if I am addressing the wrong points.


-Andrew

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 1:03 PM

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so what you're saying...

by

so what you're saying is that (correct me if I misunderstand), is that potential energy is not related only to matter, but to matter/energy (either), and that the process of moving any sort of energy into orbit will result in a portion of that energy being converted into potential energy?



Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 1:08 PM

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Sort of

by Andrew

"Potential energy is not related only to matter, but to matter/energy (either)"

This statement will hold true if you are using theoretical physics and consider mass and energy to be the same thing (E=mc^2, the direct relationship between mass and energy and you could simply claim it is just unit conversion). In practical applications and real-world physics (e.g. classical Newtonian physics) you need mass to have potential energy. However, if we utilize theoretical physics and the notion that energy is directly related to mass, then you could make that connection. But, in order to calculate potential energy (mgh), you need to use mass and cannot just throw the rest energy into the equation.

Potential energy is only related to matter. However, matter is directly related to energy and could be considered an "accounting system"; therefore, through something similar to the transitive property, you could say potential energy is related to rest energy.


"The process of moving any sort of energy into orbit will result in a portion of that energy being converted into potential energy?"

The rest energy, or the total energy of what is being moved, will not change. The rest energy, which is directly proportional to mass, cannot change unless the physical features of the object change. The potential energy comes directly from the work done on the object. Remember, the work done on the object will either come from you or some machine or in some circumstances natural phenomena.

Does that sense? It makes sense in my head, but some of it may be getting lost on its way to the keyboard.

Also, remember there is a difference between rest energy and potential energy.


-Andrew

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 1:41 PM

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Potential energy is relative...

by

Take the example one step further. If you teleported your lead to an area of space relatively free of gravitational influences. You've spent much more energy to get it there, and you don't have the specter of new found potential energy to worry about. Remember potential energy is that which matter stores, so raising a block above the ground or stretching a spring converts work into potential energy.

You have to remember that when the laws regarding potential energy were created, the Earth was flat and the notion of outer space and zero g wasn't even considered, so lifting anything away from the earth was work and built up potential energy.

Catcha on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- hmph...


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 9:36 PM

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I think you are changing his initial experimental setup.

by

You are assuming an outside supply of energy (electric field, rocket engine, Doc kicking it) is being applied to move the lead mass/energy, where I think defiance is assuming the light-that-used-to-be-lead is getting up there under its own inherent energy. That changes the rules significantly.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:10 AM

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Hmmm

by Andrew

If that is what he is stating, then you're right, it changes quite a lot.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:47 AM

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to expand on Doc's point a bit

by Maker Of Toys

Having worked with a few physicists, I've found that the definition of the problem/hypothesis usually takes more time and effort than the solution/experiment does; by the time you're done with the formulation, you know what form the final result will take, and all that's left is some (relatively) simple mathematics or engineering to fill in the actual numbers. I say relatively (bad pun) because defining this sort of question is the kind of thing that keeps your Hawkings, Einsteins, Newtons, Keplers and Galileos up at night. . . the end result of which are mathematical tools that anyone with sufficient training and interest can use.



ASSUMING that your equipment was sufficiently robust to avoid run-away entropic losses. . . your initial problem statement is only a paradox because it's an incomplete definition of the problem. . . . and you may find that Newtonian physics is incomplete for this sort of exercise.

to wit:
You're not considering the whole system, nor have you defined your frame of reference. Positional (potential) energy only exists in a gravitationally- or mechanically-coupled system. . . you can't define potential energy without some way to define the positions and the forces. . . so here you're also dealing with a second mass (the Earth) several velocities (earth's rotation, earth around the sun, sun around the galaxy, galaxy through free space, mass about the earth) and forces (gravity)! until you've either accounted for all those factors, or eliminated them by your choice of reference frame, your question will look like a paradox.

Ditto kinetic energy. . . it's meaningless unless you have some reference to define your velocity, and some way to quantify the change therein.
in addition, you may have rotational energy to consider. . . again, requiring a reference frame.

but in all fully defined cases, the product of all factors is still constant. TANSAAFL.

If you TRULY make the 'lossless conversion' assumption, you find that it's a moot question. if 'inertial mass'+KE+PE = constant over the entire SYSTEM, then at no point does the system suffer loss. . . any additional 'positional energy' is exchanged for a reduction in inertial mass or KE.

(I say inertial mass, advisedly. . . every frame of reference is moving relative to some other frame of reference, and therefore it's important to remember that inertial mass remains the same _in that frame_, even if it changes in some other frame due to changes in velocity or rotation.)

Another way to look at it is: if we define the system as a test mass at rest relative to the surface of the earth in both cases, then your change in potential energy is balanced by a reduction in the rotational velocity of the system; while the mass will have accelerated and gained gravitational positional energy (which is now balanced by inertial outward forces AKA centrifugal force, and can thus only be reclaimed by slowing the mass down relative to the earth's surface), the earth-mass system AS A WHOLE will rotate slower until the test mass is returned to its starting position. Newtonian physics at work.

If the earth and the mass remain at the same rotational and linear velocities relative to some outside fixed point, then your system inertial mass must change to balance the gravitational positional energy change. . . relativity at work.

There you have two DIFFERENT answers to your question, as asked in differing frames of reference.

N.B.: the above is vastly oversimplified, and I may (probably) have poorly explained some concepts. If anyone has a more cogent explanation, please jump in with it!


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 1:53 PM

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Red Shift.

by Andrew Smith

The photons you shoot into orbit will have a longer wavelength and thus lower energy than they had at ground level.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 4:45 PM

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Redshift...

by

Is when there is a spectral change from a light emitting source that is moving away from the point of observation. Photons don't begat photons so there's no shift. (It's the same effect as those Euro sirens. The siren emits basically a standing wave that "compresses" as it closes and "expands" when the siren retreats.)

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- Actually these are products of the Doppler Effect

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 9:43 PM

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Actually. . .

by Maker of Toys

Gravity does affect photons.

See 'black hole' for the details. See also "gravitational lensing" which (IIRC) is what finally pushed general relativity into acceptance.

so, yes, photons climbing the gravity gradient off earth's surface will show a (VERY SLIGHT but measurable) redshift.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 10:25 PM

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Thank you...I stand further informed...

by

I didn't not know there was a gravitational redshift effect.

These are the sorts of things that the transport mechanism would have to account for. Traveling away from a gravity source yields frequency change, traveling distance incurs amplitude changes. So I imagine for this to work, it would have to be like radio. The lead block it transformed into a signal that travels on a much more powerful carrier wave to be reconstituted from energy at the destination site.

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- transporters here we come happy.gif


Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 6:19 PM

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Redirection

by Derranged Gadgeteer

Okay, let's say you are merlin or something and zapfry the block of lead into pure energy. That energy would be in the form of Electromagnetic radiation as Doc Said. Keep in mind though, that electromagnetic radiation is affected by gravity too. Now, on the small (read: trivial) scales of everyday light, radio, and gamma radiations, this effect is miniscule. But, the energies you're talking about (900,000,000,000,000,000 Joules, or ~500 megatons) would be affected by gravity significantly.

The effect of gravity on electromagnetic radiation however, isn't attraction, but it tends to bend the paths of radiation waves. So, your energy beam would tend to curve and more importantly, spread out. Now, your energy loss would come from the energy required to counteract the spreading effect of gravity and keep your beam headed to one place. This would come out to being equal (in a fairy-tale lossless world) to the energy required to lift the matter against gravity. So, basically, you wouldn't loose mass, you'd just have to expend energy anyway.


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 10:40 PM

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Isn't the answer simple?

by Surestick

We're all going on about some magical way to convert matter to energy and back with 100% efficiency and no additional energy needed to make it work.
That right there is a bit of a problem for me.
I imagine that you have to expend energy to convert matter to energy and back, probably considerably more than the potential energy of a 10kg block of lead in orbit.

Usually when part of a proposed perpetual motion machine has to be described as some future so far uninvented technology then you've found the part that makes the machine impossible.





Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 4:11 AM

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Aha! It's a problem of perspective

by

Here on earth we assume an object on the ground has no potential energy. Not so!
Tell that to Indiana Jones standing on one of those tiles about to give way. If he has no potential energy, he would just float!

No - the brick always had a given amount of potential energy while on the surface of the earth.
In fact, it has equal potential energy anywhere in the system so long as Earth has gravity.

Remember on the ground, the force due to gravity pulling the brick toward the center of the earth is countered by the force of the ground preventing it from getting there.

In orbit, the force due to gravity has no countering force, thus it falls.

The instant before it strikes the ground, it's kinenic energy is equal to the potential energy it would have if it were just sitting there.

Now then, if the surface of the earth dissappeared at that instant, both would fall toward the center at the same acceleration. Hmm... but they wouldn't have the same kinetic energy once they reached it. drat.

I'm sure I'm on the right track though

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 7:44 AM

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The difference is time

by

Potential energy of an object at rest is constant. But, while accelerating, potential energy must decrease as kinetic energy increases, with respect to time.

So, an object 1 light year from earth only has greater potential energy than one sitting on the surface, when you account for the additional time required to convert that potential to kinetic.

Right?

So the falling brick, over time, has converted its potential energy to kinetic. When it hits the ground, it will rapidly convert back to potential energy, equal to that of the stationary brick.
No net gain.

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:16 AM

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Help! Navy wrenchhead stuck with nut problems!

by

What were you thinking of? :D Alright, here's the skinny. I'm in the Navy, I work in Reactor Department on the USS Theodore Roosevelt. We're working on doing small valve repacks on every 1/2" standard navy steam globe valve in our power plant. Problem: the 3/4" body to bonnet nuts are being....difficult. You can't get a socket in there due to the design of the bonnet, not enough clearance on the stem side of the nut. No standard wrench commercially made will fit these nuts, because apparently it shrank. 3/4" too big, 11/16" too small. We had to pound an 18mm wrench onto it, but it's so old and corroded, there's no getting it off. Even if you were to try to put some man into it, the wrench rides up on the bonnet (again with the tight clearances). We COULD break the stud off, but then it's a work stoppage and a paperwork nightmare. Your everyday nut-splitter won't fit between the nut and body, already tried. I'm thinking about taking a cold chisel and going straight down from the top to break that nut off, but again, we might break a stud. We've already been told that just about every valve we have is going to be like this, and we have roughly 1,500 of them... 0_0 I know that having a picture would do a world of good explaining this, but the government frowns upon posting pictures of a reactor plant system :D. I'm babbling....any ideas, fellas?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:05 PM

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Take a grinder to your wrench?

by CameraGuy

Nothing wrong with modifying tools to get the job done, or having a custom tool made. Could you cut/file/grind off the parts that are interfering on the outside of an 18mm or 11/16 wrench and enlarge the jaws slightly so they fit the nuts better? Removing metal will make the wrench weaker but if you start with a high quality tool it may still be strong enough to break the nuts loose without damaging anything. Having a custom nut splitter made would be another option.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:32 PM

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RE:

by Dean

One of our guys modified an 18mm, but he's not the brightest crayon in the box. Instead of thinning out the jaw, he ground down the whole side of it and almost broke his hand when the wrench rounded off the nut. We've torched it and soaked it in penetrating oil, tried taking a chisel to a flat to unscrew it, and nothing is working. My concern with modifying a nut splitter is if I take too much off the back end, I might wind up pushing through the thinned material by brute force. It's a 3/4" nut and it's going to take some force to crack her. It's frustrating and almost worth the paperwork to just break off the stud. Of course we're on a limited budget now, so that's the last thing we want to do now.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:53 PM

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Ain't there a machine shop on board?

by Hans

And don't lie to me, either, one of my co-workers is a plankowner on that ship.

Couldn't you take a slightly small wrench down to the machine shop and have them shave it open just a hair? Heck, I'd think about dragging one of the master machinists down to take a look at the valve, and see if they have any ideas to fab up a tool.

-Hans

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:38 PM

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We HAD a machine shop....

by Dean

See, we are in RCOH right now, which is a complete overhaul of the ship. The whole goal of RCOH is to have the ship back in practically brand-new condition. Every machine in the MR shop is gone, I already checked there. And the MRs are always nowhere to be found. :P

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:47 PM

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That's the nature of MR's

by Chase

Hit up a tender if one is nearby or go to SIMA wherever you are. Either will have the facilities to machine you whatever you can dream up and in numbers sufficient to allow a number of people to be working at the same time. If you get really desperate, hit up the manufacturer to see how they do it, or buy your own tools.

I've always wondered why Machinist Mates operated and maintained equipment and Machinery Repair types were machinists.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:14 AM

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What about a tube socket?

by

Have your machinists cut the side out a 11/16" socket (clearance it so it fits) Put the cutout side toward the bonnet. Douche it in penetrating oil and maybe a couple of love taps....

You know, if they are as rusted as you say, trying to break just the nut off might take the stud anyway. How easy is it to replace the stud? When Dad worked on heavy machinery, he found it easier to just snap off the 5/8" stove bolts that hold grader bits on than trying to remove a bolt that it rusted and packed with dirt. Granted, these weren't studs that you'd have to finish digging out, but still....

Have you tried a GOOD, TIGHT combination wrench?

Catchya on the Flip Side -- Have you RTFM? I'm sure there's an official tool happy.gif

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:55 PM

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RE:

by Dean

Ya know, that might just be crazy enough to work. The stud itself is relatively easy to replace, the problem arises when you have to replace it. Everything we are replacing is consumables. The stud is a controlled nuclear material and that's a whole separate mess. Yeah, we used the tightest combo wrench we could find and it still rides up the body. There is only about 1/8" clearance at the widest part. And we dug through the trusty manual, and the manual assumes that people aren't lazy and actually keep up with their maintenance and not just sign it off. If it's rusty, they may just wirebrush it off. If it's corroded, and they don't want to deal with it, they just throw another coat of silver paint on it and call it a day. Aggravating.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:03 PM

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If I'm understanding right...

by

The bonnet is a bell shaped casting with the studs/nuts around the outside holding it down.

You might even try squashing it a couple of times with a pair of vise grips (I imagine that only the tong style ones for welding would do) Might be able to squish it just enough to get the threads to let go.

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- Helluva time to run out of silver paint isn't it? happy.gif


Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:13 PM

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pull it all

by 50blues

pull the stud and nut, then soak it and take the nut off the stud?



Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 5:10 PM

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I have a solution. Try pressing [enter] once in a while. yeesh.

by IDN

he he, no no, wink.gif I kid I kid!

I hear "Blaster PB" works well for loosening nuts, I used it once, it preformed better than WD-40, or seemed to.
Get it hot with a torch, I would say, thats what farmers do.



Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 10:08 PM

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I second Blaster PB

by

I once had to remove a rear axle from a '72 T-Bird with just hand tools. A couple of bolts were very much stuck. Blaster and a torch was the only thing that got some of those bolts to move.

If you haven't tried this specific penetrating oil, you might want to give it a shot. Plus it smells good if memory serves.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:23 AM

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Funny that I should say it, but it is PB Blaster...not blaster pb....

by pbjosh

And yes, that should help quite a bit. I did a good rebuild of my boat's cooling system this summer and the bolts that were almost to stripping point came off 1/2 hour later with just a small bump.

Great stuff.

Josh

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 1:09 PM

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Blaster's good, but Kroil's better. Seriously, it's magic. (NT)

by Kenn Mikos



Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:48 PM

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Oh it smells wonderful

by

However it is know to be made of ground up fairies and holy water. Best procedure, or the one I use most of the time, is to let it soak. Soak the offending part, aiming for the threads, with PB Blaster. Beat on it with a hammer a bit to try and open up a passage so the stuff can seep in deeper, then try and wiggle it back and forth a bit with a wrench to the same effect. Once that's done let it sit for a good 20-30 minutes and then try again. For absolutely amazing results let it sit over night.

Now a word of caution. This stuff works best on rusty bolts, I'm not exactly sure but I believe it eats the rust somehow in addition to lubricating the threads. If what you have there is the nut being heat shrunk onto the fitting, you're never going to get that off without breaking the nut. I'm not saying the PB Blaster method isn't worth trying but I am saying your problem doesn't seem to be a rusted on fastener so it may not be as magical for you.

Doc's method sounds pretty good if time consuming if this doesn't work.

Good luck,

Matt

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:11 PM

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THANK YOU! I thought I was going nuts reading that.....(NT)

by Travis Mark

No Textie for you!

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:15 PM

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I dunno, but...

by D D

Are torches permitted in that area? What about getting a small pin-point torch or torch lighter and trying to heat up just the nut, then throw a wrench on it before it cools down and hitting it with a hammer?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 10:21 PM

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An option...

by

Using a centerpunch and a short, stiff drill- like an 1/8" spotting drill- "chain drill" through one of the flats. In other words, drill a series of holes as close together as possible, parallel to the bolt.

Use a depth stop, a short drill, a piece of wood, whatever, to hold the depth of each hole to just a hair short of the thread peak.

Back up the nut with a wedge, an appropriately-sized scrap of barstock, or whatever- then smack the nut on the drill line with a sharp cold chisel.

All you have to do is crack it. That'll take the tension off, and you should be able to twist it off fairly easily with a normal wrench.

If you have a lot to do, then I suggest buying about a thousand double-end 1/8" stub-length drills, task half a dozen guys as drillers, a couple as chislers, and three or four as wrenchers.

Might not be the best system, and it'll depend on the skill of the drillers to not go too deep and damage the studs, but it'll work.

You can also use a plasma cutter... happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 11:38 PM

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can you show us a drawing of the nut and bonnet?

by

Also, where are you, Newport News? I only ask as I'm 30 minutes south of the James from the yard. I have mill and lathe and dont mind helping.
What material is the nut, brass, bronze or stainless?


Lee

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 2:55 AM

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Penetrating oil, patience, vibration and thermal shock.

by Maker of Toys

Once you get a wrench on it, bounce the wrench around a little with a hammer. Doesn't have to be bend-the-wrench hard, but keep after it. As someone else pointed out, the combination of penetrating oil and vibration will eventually get all but the most abused fasteners loose, and I find that torsional vibration works even better than just smacking the offending part.

Have you tried the box-end equivalent of a crows-foot wrench? (i.e. a traditional wrench 'end' that will go on a 1/2" or 3/4" ratchet or torque wrench?) I find that box-ends will remove bolts that open ends will not, even if you have to press the nut/bolt out of the wrench after. I think Snap-on has them. . . Craftsman may also. One of those and a very deft hand with an impact gun might shake things loose enough for a more traditional approach to take over. Your safety officer may have kittens if you try this, so be warned.
DO NOT try this with an open-end crow's foot- it'll wind up in someone's nostril or worse.

If heat is contra-indicated for safety reasons, can you get some dry ice or liquid nitrogen on the mating part? in any case, the faster you can heat or cool it, the better, in my experience. . . ANYTHING to get that material moving relative to the mating part.



Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:47 PM

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CRC Freeze Off

by ta2maki

Another option for penetrating lubes. I've had pretty good experiences with this stuff. I've taken off transmission plugs with it that local mechanics gave up on using pb blaster and wd40.

It's like frozen pb blaster.

http://www.crcindustries.com/files/Freeze-Off%20Sell%20Sheet.pdf

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 4:54 PM

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how does it compare to kroil?

by paul

never used kroil, but wd-40 and liquid wrench have never done much for me. i've been meaning to order something stronger than those two (they're all the local hardware stores seem to stock), but i'm not sure if i should go with kroil or perhaps this stuff...

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 6:01 PM

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taperd sockets

by

I have a set of Snap-on tapered easy off sockets that have a reversed spiral set of teath for cutting into the nuts in question. They also have a hex head so you can get an open end wrench on it and it would take up very little space. If you dont need to re-use the nuts I would recomend something allong those lines.

Heres a pic
[img][linked image][img/]

I used a tool like this to remove exhaust manifold bolts with over 50 years of neglect piled on them. They should make short work of anything even remotly well maintained.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 5:25 PM

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I'm actually working on a hydrogen fuel cell car!

by Spyder95

i've posted this on a few other more car-oriented forums, but i figured you guys would get a kick out of this:

I attend Missouri University of Science and Technology (formerly University of MIssouri-Rolla), a premier engineering school and we were one of 17 schools chosen from over 300 American, Canadian, and Mexican universities chosen for the ECOcar Challenge, a 3-year competetion to build alternative energy vehicles. Last year (the first of the 3), we competed to see which alternative energy we would be assigned and we were chosen to build a hydrogen fuel cell car!

now, this competetion is huge. It is hosted by the Department of Defense and GM actually gave each team a 2009 Saturn Vue to modify! we recieved the car a couple weeks ago an the school actually built us a shop to work on it in (complete with a 2-post lift that is to be installed within the next month or 2). the problem is, the majority of the team are grad students from various engineering fields. normally that wouldnt be a problem, but they are nearly ALL theory based and barely any of the can even change their own oil let alone rip apart a brand new car and build it from scratch. that's where I come in.

I have been named the team's Vehicle Integration Team Leader and shop manager! I am so damn happy i get excited every time i think about it! i just thought you guys would hear about it so when we start getting some work done on it pretty soon, i will pe posting up a build thread about it and updating it as often as i can!


Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:58 AM

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CONGRATS!

by THAT guy

Congratulations!

Sounds like one hell of a nice opportunity and resume builder.

I've never liked the idea of fuel cells in cars though. For them to be efficient they have to be very large/heavy or have very low output current with a large and heavy battery bank. They're also very expensive, take several minutes to warm up, do not operate in cold weather, and require as many support systems as a common ICE. The only improvement over the last twenty years has been the use of a cheaper alloys than platinum and even they are crazy expensive.

A massive improvement in battery technology is one of the things that could solve most of a fuel cell's problems...Although if batteries improve ...why even use a fuel cell in the first place?



Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:16 AM

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Gratz x2!

by

So now spyder, your job is to work around all the issues that "THATguy" listed and prove him wrong! but aside from that, again, congrats it sounds like an amazing opportunity.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:27 AM

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Wednesday WB, robots, et al...

by Johnny Logan

Love the parts the robot legs are shedding... nuts... bolts... vacuum tubes....?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 7:04 AM

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Also love the brand of the saw! /nt

by Irregular logic

Hehe

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 10:12 AM

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I'm glad Doc...

by Anonymous Coward

I'm glad Doc used the KHIL saw in a lartger format than the background, when I was blowing the image from the background up to use as an avatar it got realy pixelated =(



Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:24 PM

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Oh I see now, Its in BLOCK letters. Couldnot make it out [nt]

by IDN

KHIL

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:04 PM

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Need a pointer...and a comment about guns in fiction...

by

I was somewhat inspired by Doc's rethreading the back of the .357 and was wondering where I could find some instructions about cutting indexed threads. So far GoogleFu only turns up rethreading naked rifle barrels (so it doesn't make much difference where they thread starts, there is nothings to line up)

The other day I was looking for pictures/information about the AGA .62 looking revolver in the anime Trigun. I was trying to figure out if if fired from the bottom of the cylinder and if it was supposed to be uber powerful (which top break revolvers are not uber strong) So I was lead to a page the had brief blurps about several different firearms in anime. It was a pretty amusing read. Apparently there are some studly gunsmiths that live in the Hellsing universe. Somehow they've managed to create:

A stretched out 1911 that fired .454 Casull
A similar 1911esq pistol made of solid silver, weighs around 30 pounds, and fires around in the .500 AE land....

And the Topper

A M1 Garand chopped into a large pirate pistol.

Gun in fiction are a funny thing, sometimes I'm impressed when the prop armorer does his homework (like in the Mummy movies, except the last one where they purported the Sten was better than a Thompson), and somewhat dismayed when they don't (like a western I saw a while back where the oldest pistol was Colt New Service, the rest were Pythons and the like). The anime page was just funny....

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- bang...


Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 8:33 PM

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Re: Need a pointer...and a comment about guns in fiction...

by CF

About the M1 cut down to a pistol -- the
Russians did that with *Mosin-Nagant rifles*
(better known as "the Tula Jackhammer" due
to the recoil...).

They had a word for it, but I can't remember
it (and couldn't spell it if I wanted to happy.gif ).

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 10:17 PM

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that's because it hard to spell Ow! in russian. N/T

by Gunslinger

not trying that one.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 10:29 PM

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Re: Need a pointer...and a comment about guns in fiction...

by Anonymous Coward

The Obrez. They are excellent if you do not need to worry about aim or followup shots, and do not have weak little girly wrists like German

[linked image]

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:34 AM

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Re: Need a pointer...and a comment about guns in fiction...

by jecook

That's.... insane.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 6:04 PM

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That's nothing..

by HTRN

Bulberry sells Pistol Barrels for the encore in 50-110 and 458 Winmag. JD Jones once had an Encore in 50 Alakan, but long throated to acomodate 50 BMG bullets that he used in a demonstation by shooting at tank hatches as long range(800 yards, IIRC)

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:13 PM

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Re: That's nothing..

by Anonymous Coward

At that point I'd assume you're just converting 90% of your powder into fire and noise anyway, so sure why not

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 12:54 AM

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Not as much as some other cartridges..

by HTRN

Because the amount of "boiler room"(case capacity) to bore size is actually a lot lower than in say, 30-06 or .223. A 458 contender with a 14" barrel can expect to see close to 4000 foot lbs - that's about 80% of what it generates in a 22" rifle barrel. 50-110 are typically not loaded fast anyway, and with heavyweight molds(upwards of 700 grains) it's actually a pretty good cartridge in a pistol

What does become noticeable(besides recoil happy.gif ) is the amount of torque these guns have. they want to literally twist out of your hand.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:26 PM

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Re: Need a pointer...and a comment about guns in fiction...

by Anonymous Coward

Not all that unusual.

[linked image]/
[linked image]/
[linked image]/

Even Americans get the correct idea sometimes

[linked image]/




Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 12:45 AM

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Broken links and a swipe at Americans. At least the internet is consistent. NT

by Phrederick

NT

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:02 PM

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God bless YouTube...

by

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNFsUvh078I

Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 12:16 PM

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Found the page.

by Gunslinger

http://crimsonsguns.tripod.com/animeguns.html

Find the cut down m1's inteesting, but something about that just screams wrist breaker.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 10:49 PM

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There be viruses on that page...

by

as soon as it finished loading I got a nasty message from my eTrust Threat Manager.

Be aware

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 12:26 PM

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You sure?

by iregular logic

I was on that page earlier and Avira did not have a problem with it...

What was the scan it brought up?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:16 PM

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My Company uses eTrust

by

I'm not real familiar with it.
But looking back at the logs, there were two trojans called "JPEG/IFrame!generic" loaded to Firefox cache immediately when I visited that site.

So I dunno. Whatever it was, it was caught, and excised

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:37 AM

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I understand now...

by Irregular Logic

According to google, The trojan in question just brings up pop-ups that introduce you to more malware. I didn't get those popups because IE8 blocked them.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 9:57 AM

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Any idea where I can report that to Mozilla? NT

by

nt

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 10:20 AM

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Seburo

by

I always liked the Masamune Shirow stuff and his fictional Seburo brand.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seburo

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 11:11 PM

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There's a reason its called fiction. . .

by

But it is possible to chop down an M1 Garand. Granted, you have to be pretty damn good at knowing what you're doing, but it is possible. The Green hornets in Vietnam used a number of chopped M1G's on their birds for additional covering fire. Recoil wouldn't be that bad, as the operating system soaks up a chunk of it.

Mateba uses the barrel on the bottom arrangement. Interesting pistol from a mechanical standpoint.

And the .45Long Colt round that the Trigun pistol uses is actually a very low pressure round. While it can be loaded hot, the recoil gets unmanageable pretty quickly. As a result, it doen't require as massive a locking system as everyone thinks. (Keep in mind it was designed to be fired out of pistols designed over a hundred and thirty years ago, metallurgy and mechanical design has advanced quite a long way since then.)

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 6:12 AM

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Could you even imagine the amount of work...

by

To chop down an M1 Garand. It's not so much that it couldn't be done (didn't know about the chopped Nagants), but getting the gas system to work properly would be a hugh headache. You'd have to cut the barrel and report it, as well as shorting the operating rod and gas tube....Lots of work to make something that's likely to take teeth as payment.

Yeah, I know the 45 Colt isn't the hottest round, and there are 45 Colt and 44-40 top breaks. They're just not common. Fantastic fiction has a habit of giving their characters "WidowMakers" to shoot (IIRC the guy in The Highwayman TV had a large pistol that fired some sort of 20mm round), I thought Trigun was no different.

The underbarrel is an interesting concept. Don't think I'd want one, but it is interesting.

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- Does like the look of top break revolvers though...

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:08 PM

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Re: Could you even imagine the amount of work...

by Anonymous Coward

Depending on the exact length this is not fundamentally different from most semiauto carbines. AKs have an even less cletus-friendly piston and there's like a million homebrew Krinkov knockoffs out there.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 12:48 AM

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Chopping an M1G

by

Its not as difficult as you would think. Take a look at the various 'tanker' M1G conversions. While a lot dont run right, (usually due to screwed up or junk recievers) there are a large number that do. I've shot one that was chopped to 14" with a 2.5 inch FH (perm attached) on it to be legal. It was rebarrelled in .308, and the guy who owned it never had a malfunction in almost 1200 rds of Indian. Which I wouldnt believe either unless I had seen it with my own eyes. . . .

As for recoil, its not going to break your wrists. If you want something that could break your wrists, check out the guy who made a Colt SAA clone in .600 Nitro, and is working on one in .700. . .

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 7:13 AM

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Low Barrel Revolvers

by

I was familiar with Revolvers with their barrel on the bottom of the frame long before I saw (and now own) Trigun. The idea is to place the axis of recoil lower on the frame. This mod seems to have generally done on Smith and Wesson revolvers or Dan Wessons. A generic term for the style is "Pingun" as they were frequently used in siloutte matches to shoot bowling pins. With the lower axis of recoil it is possible to get follow up shot off quicker.

Dago

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 7:37 AM

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Underslung revolver info

by Nighthawke

One version is the Mateba Unico Model 6. It was chambered in the standard small pistol calibers, ranging from the .44 S-W Special, to a hunter's variant in .44 Rem Mag.

The Grifon (as pictured below) variant was chambered in .44 and .357 Magnum, respectively. But also the .454 Casull monster pistol cartridge.
It was featured prominently in the Ghost in the Shell manga and OVA series. I believe the detective Togusa carried it as his regular sidearm. Rather unusual since the Mateba's were rather fragile due to their design.

http://www.dreadgazebo.com/gunporn/?p=55

[img][linked image][/img]

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 12:51 PM

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And.....

by Renegade_Azzy

They are semi-auto happy.gif

Handled a 357 Mateba once, very cool idea. Blowback slide recocks the hammer and rotates the cylinder. Im guessing that a top slide would have just put too much movement above the axis of the pistol, and why they wanted to go bottom axis.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 9:38 AM

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Someone's been enjoying hellsing [n/t]

by Anonymous Coward



Posted on Nov 6, 2009, 8:01 AM

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Another "What's this?" contest!

by

http://www.popsci.com/diy/article/2009-10/guess-what-8

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 3:59 PM

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Some kind of sowing machine?

by

I thinks its an industrial sowing machine of some kinde but I have so real basis for that. Its just a guess. As to its use I would have to say boat sails. Again Im just guessing...

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:13 PM

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It's a bookbinder...

by

It's an industrial bookbinder- basically a sewing machine to sew book pages together.

Well, probably. happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:23 PM

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My hunch says leather working... NT

by



Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:22 PM

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i'll guess

by IDN

I'll take a wiled guess.

You insert your limbs into the machine and it threads SS wire through your arteries, up to your brain.
Its for electricians, they usually get their arteries wired-up, for, well you know, for obvious reasons...

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 6:56 PM

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Doc's right. it's an OLD bookbinder.

by Nighthawke

I never seen one that old before. I've worked binders before, taller than this one. This one must be designed for sitting users.

I wonder who got at the spool of wire, that looks an expensive mess.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:36 AM

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Found A Used Mini...Help With Price?

by RA

Ok

I casually started to look fora Mini (see my electro post below) and found what looks like a nice gun on one of the PB forums. $200 shipped with a hard Invert case.

Great price? Good price? Wait for a better deal price?

Rob

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 3:08 PM

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1st gen or 2nd?

by pbjosh

If you can, get the newer one. It has most of the issues worked out and in a good running gun by most accounts. If it is the newer version, $200 isn't bad. Prices seem to range about $150-$250 or so.

Do they have any extra barrels? Any UPs? Anything? or just gun in box?

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 3:35 PM

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Just gun with case

by RA

I'm leaning towards waiting.

Rob

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 3:47 PM

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yes wait. please wait.

by Gunslinger

that price is horrid. i've seen guys at my local field trade mini's with full freak kits for $100

coming from my experiences of being in the market for various markers. wait a bit. look around between a few models and one will come up within a couple weeks that fits your budget and exceeds your desired performance. a lot of the time I find stock guns at more than i would care to spend and just pass them on. a week or two later some one, without fail puts up a nicer ,well decked setup for sale at much less than i was going to pay for a stock gun.

my bottom line is don't be in such haste that you jump the gun and buy the first thing in your price range.

another thing, don't get hung up on one gun if you're only spending $200 or any amount. there are more than Minis.

As to where you find a marker, I say EBay. people may moan and whine about it, but i ave insanely good fortune and pick up guns the run great from people with no feedback for $100-$200.

speaking of cheap, my $98 comes in tomorrow, I love the postal service. it makes my workload seem less bad.



Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 11:10 PM

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It is Nov 3rd: Patent is Issued

by pbjosh

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7610907.PN.&OS=PN/7610907&RS=PN/7610907

Enjoy!

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 12:29 PM

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PDF link inside

by y0da900

http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat7610907.pdf

Congratulations. Lots of drawings with interesting potential.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 12:58 PM

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Much better link - thanks!

by pbjosh

I am going to use that.

So, what do ya think?

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 2:33 PM

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Some interesting concepts

by y0da900

Some of them I like a lot more than others, mostly due to balancing, but they're all very interesting. I tend to prefer valves that rely on a normally open pilot system and rely on lowering the pressure to open the main valve opposed to normally closed valves that must build pressure, just a personal preference though. Do you have working versions of several of the styles? I had guessed almost exactly the operation of figure 1 from a picture you had posted a couple of years ago, I think it was the one of the mess on your coffee table happy.gif Looking at them though, it easily could have been set up like any of several of those options. I've got Spyder retrofit valve drawings almost identical to several of those, but they are almost all set up as closed bolt guns, or Aedes like guns with a blow forward system.

Have you tested the differences between having the inlet of your valve body come out like a tube as shown opposed to extending the face and having it tapered in like a funnel?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 3:46 PM

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is anybody else having trouble with this link?

by paul

it's downloading, but at 25-50 kbps. i'm on cable that hits 30-35 megabit downstream, so there's obviously something wrong on their side.



Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:54 PM

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alternative pdf link

by paul

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7610907.pdf

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 10:06 PM

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Congrats!

by Ketira

While I'm not a techie, I appreciate the importance of a patent.

Just don't do what my grandfather did: he created a better conveyor belt for assembly-line machines....only to sign the patent & copyright away to a rival company who never did implement it. sighs

So play hardball when someone offers what appears to be a good amount for it. It might be "too good to be true" down the road.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 1:06 PM

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The plan: bring it to market myself

by pbjosh

So, we will see how that goes!

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 2:34 PM

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Luck, hon! n/t

by Ketira

no text here

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:30 PM

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happened to me....twice

by ydna

In fact I was discussing it with josh a few yonks ago. Back in those days I didn't know to include a stipulation in the contract about the IP actually being produced (and what should happen if not, or if the company goes out of business, etc etc). I had a really slick Ion upgrade that I sold to an associate of mine who then took a new job in another state and I haven't heard from him since. who knows what happened to it.

live and learn...

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:53 PM

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Awesome!

by Roger

Are you ready to move forward?

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:10 PM

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In the works...

by pbjosh

Not as fast as I want it to, but it is moving...

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 9:38 PM

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It's about time!

by

happy.gif

Good on ya. Now let's hope that Smarty-Parts has an infringing model in the works and will be forced to pay you royalties. happy.gif

'Course, they'll just backdate their application and sue, but hey, what else is new?

Now, remember, you said you'd send me a sample or prototype, back when I assembled your mystery gun... happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:33 PM

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Oh, you get one, if anybody can Floccinaucinihilipilificate a paintball gun it is you-

by pbjosh

I really can't wait to get a few in hand. As soon as I do, there are a few testers who will get one, and you are on that list.

Josh

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 9:37 PM

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I wish that was a verb (nt)

by icouldbeahero

nautical tricotomy

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 12:16 AM

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I do believe, technically, it is!

by Deus Machina

Ahem: 'Floccinaucinihilipilification' is the act of estimating something as valueless.

I actually knew that off the top of my head, too!

Thank you, Uncle John's bathroom readers!

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 1:55 AM

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As far as I know there is no verb form, though, just the noun

by icouldbeahero

Doc's review of the marker might be a floccinauccinihilipilification, but I don't think it is "proper" to say that he floccinauccinihilipilificates the marker.

But really everyone one gets 10 points for knowing the word.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 7:30 AM

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Actually, it is proper...

by pbjosh

From:http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/floccinaucinihilipilificate

VerbInfinitive
to floccinaucinihilipilificate
Third person singular
floccinaucinihilipilificates
Simple past
floccinaucinihilipilificated
Past participle
floccinaucinihilipilificated
Present participle
floccinaucinihilipilificating


to floccinaucinihilipilificate (third-person singular simple present floccinaucinihilipilificates, present participle floccinaucinihilipilificating, simple past and past participle floccinaucinihilipilificated)

1.(colloquial) To describe or regard something as worthless.

My geek is better then yours. :P

Josh

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 8:09 AM

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I'd like mine!

by

I'd like mine...small grip and yellow!
You have the address!
Check your email about that other thing!


PyroFiend


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:28 AM

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I can't get Gmail working here!

by pbjosh

I wrote you a few dozen times and it doesn't want to go through.

Hit my email at work: josh.coray at ch2m dot com.

Josh

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 11:43 AM

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sent

by

Email sent.

Posted on Nov 7, 2009, 9:29 AM

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hot damn!!!

by

Congrats!!!

if you need any help, just let me know! you know where to find me!

now dont have to much fun with it! :D

-Levi

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:54 PM

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Re: It is Nov 3rd: Patent is Issued

by Anonymous Coward

There appears to be no technical benefit to a similar spool valve with an in-line layout.

Will the markers protected by this patent offer any measurable improvement over existing products or are they aimed at the market just wanting something different?

The way it's worded makes it sound almost like it would cover traditional spools as well. I don't see anything that says the bolt and spool can't be in the same tube.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:41 AM

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No, Yes, Yes and No.

by pbjosh

No:

The benefit is that the bolt is separate from the valve and spool design. So the designs are not restrained by having to have the air/valve/drivetrain behind the bolt. Disconnecting the bolt makes it easy to remove or clean without having to de-gass and disassemble the gun. Look at how long it takes to clean an Ion. It allows for a simpler drivetrain design that can incorporate far fewer critical o-rings, or just be different in a myriad of ways.

Yes:

In simplicity of design and ease of cleaning and repair. Smoother action due to less cycling mass, no hammer/no poppet action, and tunable piston balancing. It might not be perfect, but it could be said that even a Nelspot 007 did the same thing an Ego does - fire a paintball.

Yes:

There isn't anything that says it can't be in the same tube, but the 'No' is because it is based on the communication of the bolt as driven by the spool. So, if I built a spool valve design that had a connector like on a Tippmann where the spool connected with the bolt and drove it separately, yes, that is covered. But the linkage would have to be a separate component, not a part of the spool. So existing or most future spool valve guns would not be covered.

Josh

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:18 PM

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Re: No, Yes, Yes and No.

by Anonymous Coward

What if the bolt screwed into the spool?

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 4:08 PM

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I don't know

by pbjosh

But, prior art being prior art, I doubt I could convince even myself of it being covered by the patent.

Josh

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:09 PM

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Re: I don't know

by Anonymous Coward

If it does, wouldn't prior art invalidate the patent?

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:34 AM

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If you look at the references

by pbjosh

I have a very lengthy run down of 1 part spool valves in the patent. If you look at my patent it is based on a spool connected to a dump chamber moving a separate part that communicates to the bolt.

The funny part is the only area we had an issue with was the wording on the Angel patent that uses a claim based on calling the lower hammer a piston. The wording was vague on their part, so we had to re-define a few things.

Josh


Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 6:25 AM

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hmm......

by paintball sycho

reminds me a bit of teh shocker 4x4 in the lower tube. kinda a stacked tube spool valve marker. i like it.should leave a lot of options for custom milling. nice work!

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 12:19 PM

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That is exactly what it is...

by pbjosh

It is a patent on all stacked tube spool marker designs that have the spool drive the bolt. Reguardless of the direction, action, or connection between the spool and the bolt.

It isn't a separated spool valve design, like the Shocker though. In that case the bolt and the drive train move independant, and are not covered by this patent.

The advantages as I have seen them are: Built on a simple existing body design as used in the spyder/intimidator types of markers (though smaller and slimmer,) low number of critical o-rings, tunable designs and setups, and for once a design that allows the bolt to be cleaned easy and simple on a spool valve gun without the need to de-gass it and tear it apart.

I have some tricks I can throw in to cut down the air usage also, and the first version I am working with right now are tiny and simple.

Should be an interesting gun.

Josh

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:02 PM

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Nice!!

by niteHawk

I'll n'th the "Bout time" comments happy.gif
Now bring it to market so we can all give you money happy.gif

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 4:38 PM

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Thanks... and working on it!

by pbjosh

Hopefully thre will be something to see in the spring.

Josh

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 8:30 AM

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Doc, I'm sending you a soggy keyboard for repair.

by Maker of Toys

Today's strip has actually happened to me. I guess that's what I get for stealing your "crack of Dawn" line.

Now my sides hurt.

Thanks! Keep it up!

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 9:37 AM

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classic TWB goodness, slightly scruffy, hooked elbow leaning, and welding a weapon . . .

by IDN

more potent than any Aceraceae.

Go for the K.O. Doc!
That no-neck is staggering, hit em again!
Send him into a coma!

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 1:31 PM

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For me, that's a Life hazard.

by Ketira

--and no, I'm not kidding. Folk with my "Crazy condition" tend to think of something...

...only to have the train of thought derail at the last second. :/ At least I make people laugh when I explain it that way. wink.gif

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 1:31 PM

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i initially thought that might be a joke website...

by spyder95

you keep scrolling down and it gets more and more off topic until it is just youtube videos and pictures of pretty girls and nice cars :D

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 1:34 AM

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Try this one instead:

by Ketira

www.brainplace.com --it's Dr. Amen's website. (No, you're not seeing things; that's his real name, and yes it's pronounced the way you'd say it in church.) He has astonished the medical world to actually prove that this condition is Neurological via his SPECT images.

I just generally use One ADD Place as a starting point/overview site for folks to get a general understanding of this "crazy condition." Dr. Amen's site is more technological and may be more to your liking.

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 3:00 AM

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Aah the "ooh shiney" sindrome:) man do i suffer from that ALOT

by FireFrenzy

the downside of mixxing an above average IQ with ADHD with an interest field which is like "everything" results in pretty much everything being "ooh shiney" or "i wonder if i can make that work"

And i am pretty sure if doc sprung that line on me i'd be "wtf" for a while afterwards too...

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 2:50 AM

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I'm glad I'm not the only one on here with that problem!

by Ketira

Yes, I have above average IQ.....although I tested out earlier in this Life at the Genius stage. (A few experiences with the FL School system may have confused me a bit.)

Although with me, it's "oooh..... KITTY! ...Oh, I'm sorry, what were we talking about again?" wink.gif

I'm only thinking about tinkering when it comes to graphics nowadays. ;>

Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 2:56 AM

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Oh yes!

by

Reading this forum, having a high IQ and fast access to Google can sometimes lead to an hour or two vanishing - but be very educational at one and the same time wink.gif

Cheers,

Greebo

That being said... there's a BIG difference between common sense and high IQ... I know Mensa members that I wouldn't trust with a hammer and a nail!



Posted on Nov 5, 2009, 2:40 PM

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No-neck has had fault and will now restart.

by Anonymous Coward

Neurological BSOD's are always fun ^.^

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:31 PM

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Let me get this straight...

by ABTOMAT

Dawn is heartbroken because Doc doesn't have the right rod for her crack?

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 8:29 PM

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Spot on! (nt)

by

happy.gif

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 3:22 AM

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And now, something completely different.....

by Ketira

....like a nice large pic of the Ares 1-X rocket going up from KSC. I was watching from here at home, and the first stage was visible for a long way as it went due West into the atmosphere.

Problem is, it's not a complete success; not only is the rocket damaged, but so is the pad. But I think it was a nice first try!

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 9:38 AM

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Love that shockwave. . .N/T

by Maker of Toys

not trivial

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 11:18 AM

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WOW! Now that's a pic!!!

by Nighthawke

The Mercury/Gemini/Apollo "boilerplate" flights didn't fare so well either. With rockets in their infancy, there was a steep learning curve ahead for the crews to get it right. More than a few test articles got dinged up, but that is what they were there for. Little Joe I and II test runs with the Mercury and Gemini boilerplates were interesting to watch, considering the launch vehicles were cobbled together Sergeant and Agol kick motors.

The booster was a kitbash, not really a production article. The chutes do need help there, most definitely, but the damaged segment is just that, a replacement part that another segment could easily take its place.

The pad, hell, it's probably in better shape than the Apollo/Saturn 4 flight. The tower had many fires and major damage from the first Beast lifting off. Walter Cronkite had to shag rug to get away from the ceiling tiles falling around him. Everyone underestimated the the power of the Saturn V.

Same with STS-1. The pad got the crap beat out of it by the combination solids and shuttle engine knockout punch.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 11:27 AM

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Is it just me ...

by CTPatt

... or does anyone else find that the pressure wave around the front makes the whole thing look like a giant flaming lawn dart?

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 12:37 PM

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hehe

by

http://cheezburger.com/View.aspx?aid=2793947904

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 12:48 PM

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Flavor Injector

by Crighton

I was thinking
http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?order_num=-1&SKU=11791182

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 12:52 PM

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Flavor Injector

by Crighton

I was thinking
http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?order_num=-1&SKU=11791182

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 12:57 PM

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Now you did, here some more

by Izzy

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]



Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:21 AM

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Oh yea

by Izzy

Its images 7 & 8, you can see the Shuttle "Atlantis" sitting on Pad 39A.

All those images were taken by KSC employees and friends of mine and are just a few of what my friends and family that work out there have forwarded to me.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:25 AM

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So why not make a web page gallery?

by Ketira

That way, everyone can see them - and you could give credit where credit is due.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 12:45 PM

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TWB coming up with broken image link

by Ketira

sighs

DocN, I hope you're on the phone with that webhost of yours.... and threaten that you'll switch to Dreamhost if they don't fix it ASAP.

Oh, and if you want to see a comic that does use Dreamhost for everything but the domain, check out Oh My Gods!.... although Shivian, 'cause of RL issues, tends to update sporadically. But it's a good example of a comic hosted by Dreamhost.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 9:04 AM

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NOT recommending DH.

by Wojtek

While not exactly unreliable, their shared hosts to be very overloaded. Think "waiting 10-20 seconds" staring on a blank screen with "Sending request..." in web browser's status bar.
Also not recommending DownTownHost, have very bad admins who change stuff on your account as they wish without even bothering to send you an email about it.
Now, I _heard_ good things about Bluehost, but never had any firsthand experience with it.


Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 1:16 PM

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What's your connection?

by Ketira

Because, even though there's not much there, my pages come up very quickly.

I know they've been having problems with some of the newer servers, but mine seems very reliable. Try my 404 page and see how long it takes to load at whatever speed you're using to access the internet.

Any problems I've had with them have been because of unforeseen complications (like the blackout they & MySpace {same building} had a few years back). For what they offer and the price they offer, I find it to be a very good bargain.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 12:57 PM

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Seems that it's specific to some machines...

by Wojtek

Your site is on apache2-moon.yoda.dreamhost.com
Most of the sites I have problem with seem to be in the *.cyclops.dreamhost.com range.
Still, it's that way since over six months, it's that way for people from all over the globe, and I doubt that you can choose on which machine your site will be hosted on.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 5:18 AM

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Not a hosting problem...

by

That was a brain fart. I did up the strip, set the scheduler, spent an hour sending out donor wallpapers (thanks, everyone!) and having to come up with some new screen sizes on occasion, then went to bed.

Forgetting, of course, to actually upload the strip.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 1:55 AM

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*facepalm* "smack!" lol... NT

by

i eye said no text


Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:32 AM

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I second that facesmack!

by Ketira

ROFLMAOASTC! (For those of you who are new to my acronym: ....And Scaring The Cat)

Nothing like human error, eh DocN? I'm glad I posted!

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 12:50 PM

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So that begs the question...

by

...who won the original? Or failing telling who, what donation value won the original? =^.^=

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:33 PM

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OT/TWB: Find Darpa's Balloons on 12/5/09

by Dan Voils

http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/11/02/0056236/Find-DARPAs-Balloons-Win-40K

"The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency today offered up a rather interesting challenge: find and plot 10 red weather balloons scattered at undisclosed locations across the country. The first person to identify the location of all the balloons and enter them on the challenge Web site will win a $40,000 cash prize. According to the agency, the balloons will be in readily accessible locations, visible from nearby roadways and accompanied by DARPA representatives. All balloons are scheduled to go on display at all locations at 10:00AM (ET) until approximately 4:00 PM on Saturday, December 5, 2009."

Might be an interesting storyline for Doc's new building.

Dan

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:41 AM

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Not to mention that *that's* a nice prize.... n/t

by Ketira



Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 8:55 AM

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Official link...

by

http://networkchallenge.darpa.mil/

If we're lucky 10 of us will each spot one and split the money. I could use $4000 right about now, work is planning on cutting hours.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 7:51 PM

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A couple days late, but I made a part for a friend's Halloween costume. (video)

by Deus Machina

Ghostbusters fans rejoice! He didn't have the tools to cut, tap, countersink, thread, and knurl, so I ended up making the 'Ion Arm'.

[linked image]

You can see it in the video, but it's thoroughly a cosmetic part.

What's really impressive is how they finished it up, complete with lights...



And other... 'realistic enhancements'.



Quite a feat, for Canadians! Enough to make Egon proud.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:33 AM

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Bah, embed fail. Links.

by Deus Machina


Vid 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GcESRBNI7U

And Vid 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tAFRpJlY7c

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:35 AM

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That's pretty kick ass

by

Can't believe you haven't gotten a comment sad.gif

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:39 PM

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Anyone familiar with Graziano lathes?

by

A local seller has this sad-looking but possibly salvageable Graziano SAG 210 lathe:

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

[linked image]

The black gunk on the ways is supposedly some kind of cosmoline-like substance (it's waxy/tarry) so the ways are allegedly still pretty good under it. Spindle turns freely, gears shift nicely (not under power, but the shifters move and "clunk" like they're going into gear) but obviously this thing'd be yet another hefty project.

Worst part is the cross-slide. The owner says he has the handwheel and screw and whatnot, but the toolpost and cross-slide casting are missing.

The brief writeup on these models on Lathes.co.uk mentions some nifty features (like shift-on-the-fly) and this particular one has some useful aspects; a 2"-plus through-hole, D1-6 spindle, an MT5 (!) tailstock barrel and a 22" swing (!!)

The guy's out of his tree on the price, but might be willing to dicker or do a partial trade. What I'd like to know is how good this brand is in general, how good these machines are, availability of parts, and so on. Basically, assuming I could get it for scrap price or nearly so, would it be worth the effort of putting this thing back together?

The cross-slide is of course a major issue. Anyone know of a parts machine, a scrapper that might have parts, or some other source?

Doc.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 11:52 PM

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Never heard of them until now

by Lakc

Thats not saying much tho, but it probably speaks to part availability. Unless your heavily into casting and pattern making, and those guys with the iron cupola are really close friends, I would run the opposite way.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 4:39 AM

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Re: Anyone familiar with Graziano lathes?

by

Grazianos are pretty well thought of, and if the lathe was in better condition I'd suggest getting it. But on that condition, no. No cross slide, cross slide screw or dial assembly, compound, heck - the whole top of the lathe is missing. Really, there's no reason to pull that off unless there was a good crash, and most crashes that would cause that level of damage is going to play hell with the headstock gears and bearings. Once you're in there you're in la-la land with $2000 bearings and $700 gears.

Even if you find the top stuff on PM for free I wouldn't buy it unless I could run it under power and check out all the speeds and such, indicate in the spindle and see what's happened there.


Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 6:01 AM

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I dunno.

by D D

If it's missing major pieces like you say, the guy's asking too much, and no chance of seeing it run under its own power...

I'd simply walk away. You got enough tools to fix as it is wink.gif


Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 2:13 PM

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Yes, I should...

by

And I probably wouldn't even have looked at it in the first place, except it was only about eight miles away, and I needed to get out of the shop.

I kind of expected it to be just a brief outing to go look at an interesting machine- and seeing it in person did nothing to change that, really. happy.gif

But once I started looking at the specs, I began to get actually interested. It's not a physically huge lathe, it's only about nine feet long, probably weighs 3500 to 4,000 pounds.

Well, yeah, actually, it's a big lathe, but what I mean is, for the thing's capacities, it's not all that huge. I mean, it swings twenty-two inches! One of the local machinists, when he had his shop, had an old Monarch that was twice this thing's size, but "only" swung 18".

Plus the 2-1/4" headstock thru-hole. That's tough to find on machines bigger than this.

The tailstock has something like eight inches of travel- I'm used to my Sheldon's barrel coming loose of the screw at precisely the 2-1/2" mark.

The tailstock takes Morse Taper 5, the spindle is a D1-6... All features I'd love to have, but to find them all on a ready-to-run machine would cost me $5,000-$7,000 plus $2,000 in shipping.

I dunno. If I could get it for scrap or scrap-plus-ten-percent, maybe.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 2:09 AM

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Russ has some good points

by Nighthawke

I'd be cautious with this unit's overall condition. I'd break out some tools and crack open the housing to see the condition of the drive train before even considering his offer. If that lathe did suffer a crash and got scavenged to operate another, then even at scrap you might be losing your shirt, esp. in transportation charges.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 6:01 AM

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Oh, I know...

by

Like I said, if it weren't for this thing's capacities, I wouldn't think twice.

Hell, even if it were cherry, I'd probably have to sell off the Logan and the Jet just to make room for it.

But the fact is, I've been thinking about getting a bigger lathe for a while now. No real plans or needs, just the usual fact- as noted in the "what mill should I get" thread below- that while I can do smaller work on a larger lathe, I can't do larger work on a smaller lathe.

Something that can swing better than 18" and has that size a thru-hole, and has 5 or 7 hp or so (I'm not sure- guessing) sure would be handy on occasion. And as I've noted before, it's something of a machine desert up here- if this thing were cherry, it'd be selling for $7,000 or $8,000. Point in fact, I'm not at all sure it won't sell anyway even in the condition it's in.

But we'll see. I can't dismiss it because if it's size and power, but I can't jump at it because of it's condition and potential for needing very expensive parts. (Besides the fact I don't have much, if any, disposable income at the moment anyway.)

Ponder, ponder, ponder. happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:45 PM

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The old say goes...

by MephitMark

A bird in the hand is better then two in the bush. You have two working lathes, which can still make you money. Better then selling them off for a machine that you will undoubtedly have to spend bucko-bucks before you can use it.

If you could get it and store it outside until such time it is working and/or you have more floor space to house it might be a route to consider. But I strongly advise not saddling yourself with a situation that prevents you from making any cash.

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 12:57 PM

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Hey Doc, meet me at the finish line?

by

http://www.hokaheychallenge.com/

How much do you think it will cost for me to ship the prize back to Michigan?

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:46 PM

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Okay, now that's a bike ride...

by

I hope you have a cast-iron butt, man. 7K is a trip and a half even in a comfy car.

Half a mil in gold? At roughly $1K per ounce, that's about 500 ounces, or just short of 32 pounds.

Take it as carry-on. See what the dude at the X-ray says. happy.gif

But yeah, you have to pass through at least Soldotna to get to Homer- Soldotna's about 12 miles from here, Homer's about 90. Keep me updated to your progress and I'll chase your ass the last 100 miles. happy.gif

Doc.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:00 AM

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Too bad it's only harleys...

by AJsarge

Despite the limit to harleys only, I'm almost willing to register my street bike (a yamaha) just to make a point.

But, 7000 miles is only 4.5 straight days of riding at 65mph. If you can keep up the pace from sunrise to sunset, you should make it in about 6-7. Just expect to run into guys who are even more hardcore and will ride 18-20 hours per day (or actually try for a straight ride).

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 11:50 AM

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.../ride 18-20 hours per day (or actually try for a straight ride)/...

by IDN

Ritalin is legal speed. No need for sleep.

I'd bet money some one is ready to go, with a full bottle.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 7:09 PM

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Several

by Gil

I think several are ready to go with drugs. Like any competition like this people will probably cheat

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 11:14 PM

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I prefer the Smothers Method...

by

If you're gonna cheat, cheat big.

In one of those "Cannonball Run" movies from the eighties, the Smothers Brothers (if I recall correctly) played two rich guys in a race to cross the US. Their plan was to leave the starting gate in their Bentley Turbo R, then drive to the airport where they'd fly to a location close to the finish line, get in their other Bentley Turbo R, and use it to drive to the finish and win.

I forget what foiled them- something wacky, of course. I'd imagine there's some rules in place to keep that sort of thing from happening, like simply recording the serial number of the bike frame/motor.

But yeah, you can pretty much count on a good number of the participants doping up on anything from No-Doz to coke and speed. Expect several crashes, lots of speeding tickets, a couple of drug busts, and probably at least one fatality. Falling asleep at the wheel on a bike is way worse than doing so in a car, and this race is pretty much designed to try and make people get as much non-sleep saddle time as possible.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 1:52 AM

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Their flight had an unruly passenger.

by Flank

"WE'RE GOING TO NICARAGUA!!!!"

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 11:45 AM

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Looking for milling machine advice

by

Over the past year I have become increasing interested in learning to do milling. I'm kind of a DIY type so I want to pick up a small mill, a couple books and go learn. My end goal in this is to build some bodies. With that in mind, can anyone help me out with knowing how small is too small of a mill?
I've been reading about mills all night now, and I'm seeing most benchtop or mini-mills have a table travel of about 8 or 9 inches. That's right at the length of a gun, should I go longer?

Another question, motor sizing, how big do I need to work with 6000-7000 aluminum? Also how fast? most seem limited to 2500rpm, is that sufficient?

Is there anything you can think of that I should be asking and have not?

Anyone have a favorite book on this sort of thing?

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 4:33 PM

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Some will pop up with links. From me, the usual.

by Deus Machina

Bigger is better. Got with an actual mill, not a mill/drill, if you can avoid it. A knee mill if you have the money and space.

As far as motors go, more powerful is better. 3-phase, if your space is wired for it or you can get that set up, or if you can use a phase converter. As for the RPM's, just about every mill out there has a variable system either via gears or pulleys. Higher RPM means smoother finish.

Quality of the mill matters, of course. Some are more than others, but most any new name-brand mill will be just fine for a garage tinker. Used, you'll have to check for some things like runout, bearing wear, etcetera. Go American if you can, but I've had good luck the more popular Chinese imports.

You will spend at least as much on tooling as you will the mill, but at least you can break that up and buy stuff when you need to. Do not cheap out on the vice, drill chucks, or any end mill holders or collets you will use to make accuracy-dependent cuts.

Stick with an R8 taper at the spindle. Much easier to find accessories for.

Go bigger than you think you'll need. It won't hurt, and you will always have a bigger project later.

Now, for the specifics from my point of view...

I, myself, *I am only speaking for me*, have been happy with my Chinese import mini-mill. It's far too small for anything smaller than a 'cocker body, does not have the power to use a flycutter (which is a great tool!) or the travel to use very large end mills, but it's accurate if you spend time with it and is large enough to do 95% of what I ask it to, when I know how to lay it out, and I got a great deal on it.

*But,* if I could do it over, I would have saved up for Grizzly's larger (I think the importer designates it 'X3') mill/drill(http://www.grizzly.com/products/6-x-21-Mill-Drill/G0619 ), which is the only benchtop I will actually recommend. Larger, more powerful, and with some nice features and a large and growing following in the hobby groups.

For your hobbies, don't expect to buy a block of aluminum and end up with a 'cocker body. Especially as a first project, before you learn the mill and its quirks and the fine measurements and such. Most of it is not a particularly hard project, but you will not be able to get the bores through from front to back on any but the very largest mills that a hobbyist will have. You will need a sizeable lathe, at least, and for those parts it would be better to start with a body blank (http://www.airsoldier.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=AOS&Product_Code=AKA-MERLIN-EXTRUSION&Category_Code=AIRSMITHING ) or have a paid machinist do that part.

Not to discourage you there, but mills suck up money quick. And if you're scratch-building bodies, it's much easier to start with a blank anyway. Long bores are a *pain.*

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:15 PM

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RF31 Mill drill.

by

I had an Emco mill on the back of my Compact 8 Lathe. I've made some nice stuff with it but I got tired of changing modes back and forth. So I bought a separate mill something basic and cheep that my state tax return could cover. My RF-31 mill is a cheep twain mill you can pick up for $700-$1,000. I don't need to use the full travel for most paintball work. But I truly would not recommend going smaller. Here is a link for some specs.

http://www.toolsplus1.com/rf31milldrill.htm

note: You also need something that can boar through the body, so it needs to be tall enough.

It is better to have and not need than to need and not have. If you live in Chicago, Detroit or any other industrial city buy the biggest used mill that you can afford. There are some nice deals to be had so be patient. Besides you may want to make more than just paintball gear.

Just my 2 cents.

brian




Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:34 PM

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as others have pointed out

by Maker of Toys

bigger is better in machine tools.

The size of the part is a minor concern. The bigger question is what tooling you need to work on the part. . .

The rule of thumb that I have heard is to get a machine with twice as much work space as the biggest part that you intend to work on. The reason being, all the tooling, work holding, etc, etc. eats up space. in the case of a paintball gun body, you will need room for the body, the cutter, and if its a drill bit/boring bar/reamer/hone, you will need space for the the drill chuck/boring head to drive the cutting tool, then you have the vice, with maybe some parallels and maybe some sacrificial material under the part so you can cut through without damaging the vice and table.

the only recommendations I have is to stay away from the 3-in-1 multi-tools.
A good benchmill MIGHT be enough, but you'll outgrow it pretty fast.
Watch Craig's List and build your warchest.
try to get a mill with a common spindle taper- I have a couple of R8 mills, and the railroad museum I volunteer at has some with various CAT taper shank spindles. . . the taper-shank stuff is strong and rigid, but costs the earth. . . . I can get cheap R8 stuff from any number of mail-order houses, and I know it'll work, but mailorder something for one of the other tapers, and you may end up with something that won't fit your particular mill.

Don't let 3-phase motors throw you off. A good variable speed drive can generate a 3rd phase for you, providing you over spec it a little. (IIRC, my ACtech 5HP VFD cost something like $350 shipped, and runs my 3 HP mill off a dryer outlet with no complaints.)

If a $350 one-time cost scares you, then go price boring heads and collet sets, and think HARD about the hobby you are about to embark on. (but remember, most of the tooling you buy, with the exception of endmills and carbide inserts, will last literally forever in home-shop service. . .)

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 8:20 PM

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that's a pretty high price for a VFD that'd be suitable for the job...

by paul

iirc, most bridgeports and their clones use a motor which is rated at 3hp (2200W) max power and 2HP (1500W) average power.

you can get away with running a VFD that's rated for the HP of your motor without any issues.

if you look around, you can find a 3HP VFD from places like dealerselectric.com for around or possibly even under $200 and it will do the job just fine. i've been using an AC tech sm230s 3HP unit with a 3HP rated motor for several years without issue...

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:20 AM

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One thing to consider...

by Moose

Most reputable VFD manufacturer's state that you need to go one frame size up on the VFD when doing single to 3-phase conversions. This is due to the heat in the two scr bridges doing the conversion.

This is especially true in an application where high torque loadings can hit relatively quickly, like when milling.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:51 AM

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cheap insurance.

by Maker Of Toys

The power where I have my shop is single phase and . . . ugly. All kind of nasty power factor shifts (lots of DEEP wells out in that neck of the woods) and voltage changes.


And I sometimes make/repair railroad parts at home, which equates to taking some pretty big cuts for an R8 mill. (The DROs on the big mill at the museum are munged up . . . and the table isn't much better. So for accurate work, I tend to take things home)
And when you have a big part set up and you're hogging material, 'pop-fizzle' is not the sound you wanna hear from your phase converter.


So I asked the experts, and followed their advice. No complaints here. . . I like it when the things I buy stay bought.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 9:30 AM

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Thanks for the rsponses so far

by

I appreciate the info you guys are giving me. I do realize this is an expensive "hobby" to get into. Fortunately I am lucky enough in this economy to make more than I need. However, I am limited on space and do not have the ability to use 220. I've got to fit this in my garage at my apartment along with my car. I've got about 3 feet of comfortable space, 4 feet if I squeeze it, and along the entire wall, so 10-12 feet.

I'm going to be looking for a used mill for the next couple months while I save up my pennies for yet another expensive hobby, but if I end up going new, i think i have it narrowed down to these two;

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Mill-Drill/G0463

http://www.grizzly.com/products/G1005Z

for all practical purposes, they are nearly the same machine, just a difference of a a round column or a dovetail column. Is that a matter of preference? I'd imagine the dovetail would be a bit more stable and I don't foresee much need to swivel the head, anyone care to toss out an opinion on this?
Also please let me know if you think I am still going too small on the mill.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 1:56 PM

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without getting my hands dirty(er)

by Maker Of Toys

my first inclination would be to get the dovetail unit, just from an accuracy and repeatability standpoint. The ability to get the head right down on top of the cutter and limit the quill extension would be good for rigidity, which helps surface finish. Too, with a dove-tail column, the potential to add CNC down the road is somewhat better. . .

OTOH, my experience with universal motors and machine tools has been, in a word, BAD. Unless you've got a good closed-loop controller ($$$.$$), the torque/RPM curve of what is effectively a series-wound DC motor are such that the cutter speed will vary quite a lot depending on load. . . so as you enter and exit a cut, your RPM will change, which will play hob with your surface finish. Also, in those times when you want to slow down (like swinging a big boring bar or a flycutter on tough/hard material) you'll find that you just don't have the torque you need.

With the induction motor, you don't get the nice, easy 'twist-the-dial' variable speed option, but what speeds you get, you really get. Still, you can also look at expanding your speed ranges by collecting extra cone pulleys and maybe a belt or two. . .

SO: with no way to try the fit and finish of the individual machines, I'd get the one with the induction motor over the one with the universal, unless I wanted to go through the pain of re-motoring with a Brushless DC motor or a encoder-feedback DC servomotor. (and in a 3/4 hp or better size, you're starting to talk money again)

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 4:51 PM

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I hadn't thought of that..

by

motor type never occurred to me to be something to look at, but I can see why it matters. Thank you very much for bringing it to my attention.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 6:08 PM

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Re: Looking for milling machine advice

by

Echoing what others have suggested: get the biggest mill you can afford/fit in the shop. You can always do small work on a big mill, but you can never do big work with a small mill. For what you want I'd suggest something in the line of a smallish Bridgeport or other common turret mill. The mill should have a movable dovetail ram so the head can be moved around relative to the knee. The head should be mounted on a knuckle so it can me moved around in 2 axis. You want the knee to be mounted on dovetails to the column so it doesn't lose registration with the spindle when you move it up & down when you change tooling. You want a lot of throat and a decent sized table.

If you keep the tools small R8 will be OK for the spindle, but a 30 or 40 taper would be a step up and have faster tool changes.

If you get a VFD look at the sensorless vector drives, they maintain torque down to low speeds and let you work w/o changing the belts all the time.

When you're bargaining keep in mind that tooling will eat a lot of your budget, so get them to throw in as much as you can get. Tooling you can't use today will become useful either on the mill or as trade material.


Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:47 AM

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Ditto what Russ said..

by HTRN

Stay away from Round column machines - you have to tram them every time you move the head. Look at so called "Column mills" where the head travels up and down a dovetailed column. Probably one of the largest hobby oriented ones is the Industrial hobbies Mill - and it's one I would recommend to anyone looking for a decent sized mill but can't fit/afford a Bridgeport..

Speaking of Bridgeports, Look to get a pulley machine over a variable speed machine - they're cheaper(although not by as much as they used to be), more mechanically reliable(mech variable speed drives in general are a pain in the ass and need regular attention), and with VFDs becoming both widespread and cheap, you can add variable speed for small money.

As for RPM... Forget it. You'll never have enough speed to hit the right speeds for 6061(with the regular spindle, anyway. There are ways around this limitation), the first shop I worked in used to run 3/8" carbide endmills at 8000 RPM, and that's only because that was the top speed in the VMC.

And oh, be prepared to spend money. In large chunks. A decent sized baby knee mill will run you 3 grand from Grizzly, double that from Jet. A used B'port will run you better than 4 grand from a Dealer... A new Acer 3VS with no powerfeeds is 9 grand. And then there's things like vises, collets, rotary tables, end mills..

If you're doing this to work on paintball guns? A Sieg X2(or one of the noname versions) would be the minimum. Don't think just in terms of work envelope - larger machines are stiffer, more accurate, and have higher HP, and therefore higher metal removal rates(sometimes jokingly referred to as "cubic dollars per minute")

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 9:53 PM

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do you think these warehouse workers made it??

by

http://www.break.com/index/bringing-down-the-warehouse.html

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 9:53 AM

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I will say

by IDN

"Yes", they are A-OK. Good footage.

Boxed paper? A few open boxes below look like brewskies, prolly not.



Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 1:00 PM

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Re: I will say

by CTPatt

I'd say the odds favor them coming out intact. Those forklifts are sturdy, and anything that would come down on them would have to bust through the forklift frame first. Since falling objects tend to follow the path of least resistance, most of the wave would deflect to one side or the other.

They'd likely be pinned until they were dug out, of course.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 8:45 AM

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Now I wish I had this picture...

by

When I was working for Target, they had a picture hanging in the Receiving area that depicted a similar accident. In the back of a Target, all the backstocked merchandise lives on this medium duty speedy rack. It's organized into aisles that are about 18 to 20 inches apart, and 15 feet tall. Target doesn't have forklifts per se, they have WAVE machines (a sort of self propelled GenieLift) and Crown high life pallet jacks. The aisles are just wide enough for WAVE. The problem with running a WAVE down there is the steering. A WAVE has "diddle wheels" on the front, and is steered by the independent motor on the back wheels. When you back up, the WAVE's front jumps about 4 to 6 inches to the side.

Somebody drove down one of the aisles, and when they went to back out, the WAVE crushed one of the vertical posts, causing the whole receiving to topple like dominoes...

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- bang...


Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 3:32 PM

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when I worked at the one in Sioux City...

by

You were not allowed to drive the Waves on that side of the back room. Just for that reason. We had these ladders w/ wheels. The waves had to stay on the receiving side of the stock room that had heavier shelving.

Still was fun to work there.

brian


Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:13 PM

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Re: when I worked at the one in Sioux City...

by Anonymous Coward

Sioux City? You actually admit to having worked in Iowa's armpit? :-P

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 6:03 PM

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They made it

by Gil

I saw it on the news. It happened in russia and surprisingly nobody was hurt

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 11:16 PM

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Re: They made it

by Nutjob

Hurt, no.

Kept their jobs...?

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 5:27 AM

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I feel like a geek for recognizing the costume!

by Deus Machina

Really that Starfox was a decent game...

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:44 AM

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Well what ELSE would you expect him to stuff a fox into?

by

That's just about the most (in)famous vulpine character that's reasonable to set up another character cosplaying as that I can think of, that's modern enough to be even remotely widely recognized.

And I'll be frank: Aside from personal characters it's just about the only single vixen character in fandom that's commonly drawn these days it seems.

Pretty decent rendition though, soon as I'm back at my main PC at home I'll be lobbin' some PayPal goodness along.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:47 AM

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Maid Marrion?

by Deus Machina

Not as skimpy, obviously, but frankly I could have gone without seeing Swampy in boxers. :P

And it's not anyone's strictly adhered to species-specific costumes, it's just convenient. It very well could have been Princess Bunhead--errr, Leia. Sorry, my geekitude's hanging out again.

Would be a little more mainstream, but far be it from me to decry a more obscure joke.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 8:09 AM

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2009-11-01 If she is suppose to be some one, you got me.I think Its a nice drawing though.

by IDN

I Just see a fantasy(dragons,ect.) theme costume.

Its a nice surprise DocN, I was not expecting anything other than the previous gags.

-sorry, I don't have a job to be able to donate :'(

But on a positive note, I'm very awesome, and most cant handle me.

heh

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 12:53 PM

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For those who don't have Nintendo among their entertainment brands ...

by CTPatt

The costume is the character Krystal, a relatively recent addition to the Star Fox series of games. (Sci-fi, anthropomorphic cast, centers around a mercenary unit of the same name.) First appearance in Star Fox Adventure; playable in the opening tutorial segment, spends the remainder of the game story in the damsel-in-distress role. Returns in Star Fox Assault as a full-fledged member of the group.

Classic heroine in a lot of ways: pure-hearted, angsty past, wise beyond her years, etc. Telepathic, has martial arts skills. Possesses a magical staff with a multitude of powers.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 2:00 PM

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Krystal...

by flagada

Google is your friend happy.gif

[linked image]

[linked image]

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 1:39 PM

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Google is NOT your friend...

by

... Or, well... that depends on what you're looking for, I guess. happy.gif

Google "starfox krystal", as I did with the "safe search" on the default moderate, and the second image is porn. More on the second page.

Google "krystal fox" and the seventh image is porn, with two others being nude.

Google "krystal furry" and four of the first seven are porn.

And that's WITH 'safe search' on.

Doc.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:12 AM

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And the funny part to me...

by

...is that just 'Krystal' with safe search OFF doesn't show any porn in the first page, closest it comes is a couple scantilly-clad models named Krystal.

It's actually showing better (and safer!) results with Safe Search off than on in this case.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 3:59 AM

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Re: Google is NOT your friend...

by flagada

I guess it depends where you are on the world...

www.google.nl is wat google defaults to over here (even if you type www.google.com).

A search on "starfox krystal" , images, results in at least 5 pages of drawn/rendered/fanart . I din't go beyond page 7 but by then still no pron...

No explanation why Doc gets those images. Maybe a new browser app that reads minds ??? (just kidding wink.gif )

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 6:58 AM

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I am irked by google's auto-redirects...

by icouldbeahero

have finally adjusted to typing google.us to get the "right" google, since google.com redirects me to google.hu. I guess I would feel differently if I lived in another country, though.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 7:13 AM

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Therefor, Since I have a new Char to add to my hate list (krystal fox).I will think of her

by IDN

I will think of her (Sandy) as a fantasy(medieval) vixen, of sorts, or something.

um, um, DIVERSION!http://www.weebls-stuff.com/toons/ptikobj/

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 6:59 PM

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alrighty then

by Gunslinger

that was an odd link there bro. rather odd.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 7:19 AM

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Re: I feel like a geek for recognizing the costume!

by CF

"That's a nice little nothing you're almost wearing."
[James Bond, _Diamonds Are Forever_]

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 10:20 PM

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Getting The Itch To Buy A Electro Again

by RA

Man I love my Tippmann 98 but after playing with some friends from work who have some electro guns I'm getting the desire to find a electro gun again. Something with select fire (semi-3 round burst-auto) sounds like fun! Now that I have HP and a decent hopper (Empire B2) I'm even more inclined to taste some modern tech.

I know this may go against the grain of most here but what would you guys recommend I might look for? I'm just a woodsballer/scenario kind of player if that helps. I'm poor so I'd like to stay around $200. New preferred but used would be Ok if it's something I can get parts for fairly easily.

Thanks for any advice.

Rob



Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 4:23 PM

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markers

by

if your playing on a reg field most fields wont let you use mods for safety.a few years ago i would have said pmi piranha or spyder as both were mostly metal markers and simple to use and parts were at every field. the sp ion has now taken the place now of most new players low end markers or the pmrs. as kee has all but killed of there marker line it wont be too long for parts to dry up. if the autococker e-frames were still out there and were in your price range i would tell you to pick one up and put in the new high end valve system.

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 6:47 PM

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Mini...

by Jim

u can find an Invert Mini used for around $200 Fantastic little gun IMO

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 7:06 PM

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Minis....

by

There was a guy on Special Ops Paintball's forum selling LNIB minis for 190 shipped. I don't know if he's still got more, but you could give it a try.

"Heisman01"

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 7:07 PM

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Guilty Consceince??

by RA

Man I've spent quite a bit of my night looking at used electro guns and educating myself about various one s I saw. I almost feel guilty now after seeing a large mass of people's viewpoint on this style of PB gun. IE How it's messing up PB because new players feel they are being over powered by them. SP and their forcing companies out of business. On and On.......

I don't know, maybe having fun with a good ole mechanical is best.

Rob

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 8:34 PM

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if the brand fighting bothers you

by Gunslinger

forego Smart Parts,Eclipse, Kee and Dye and buy a Bob Long or MacDev. a few companies have avoided most of the crap lately and still make great guns. they just aren't owned by the Gardner brothers mainly.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:31 PM

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Pawn Shop Raid

by Nighthawke

You might want to check your local pawns to see what they have in store. I've seen more than a few electros hanging on the pegs behind the counters.

And more than a few BE's too... Ick!

Consult with your local fields to see what restrictions they have applied on the modes to see if it would balance out, or nullify the advantages electros have over cockers.

Take a suggestion, shop for an emag or a autococker clone. Be a helluva investment, but well worth it.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 2:06 AM

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DP G3, Invert Mini, or PMR

by

Why those three? Small, light, on the low-end of the price scale, all come stock with easily interchangeable feednecks, all come with break-beam eyes and take 'cocker threaded barrels. Plus, they all generally perform rather well straight out of the box.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 7:04 AM

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the word of the Day is PMR

by Gunslinger

you can buy the for $100 on a good day and they outperform both g3's and Mini's. i've seen it repeatedly in the field. plus Rails tend to be more reliable than g3's and mini's.

one of my teammates owns a mini.correction three mini's because the all keep breaking on him. he plays well with them when they work but they keep falling apart in his hands.

another teammate has a g3.he's since upgraded(if you could call it that) to a bob long victory, but when we used the g3 he had no end to problems, these included his stock trigger breaking in 2 peices when dropping it on a carpet, bolt continuously sticking, and regulator problem.

my team gun whore bought an 08 PMR so my team would have a backup as we're notorious for gun problems. . he picked it up with a spare trigger frame and board for less than a hundred bucks, it worked beautifully and never bogged down on us, ever. heck i played speedball in a rainstorm with it. i picked it up from him when he downsized and am loving it.

another peice of advice would be to pick up an old icd promaster. they are around $100, reliable,small,and shoot around 17bps. i just picked one up yesterday on ebay with sticky 3 grips, a CP barrel and regulator,upgraded internals, and an AKA lpr. running total 113 dollars with shipping.

just look around man, you'll find plenty.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:18 PM

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Another word is SLG

by Gunslinger

samish to PMR , both made by proto/Dye.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:33 PM

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I will put one up here for the Invert Mini as well...

by BigMatt-MadCustoms

I picked up one up second hand a few months ago and I really love the thing...

Very light...and real good on air..

It has all kinds of settings...

My home field only allows semi only with a cap of 13 balls per sec. and to be honest thats all I need with this little thing a quick fan of your fingers and it will throw out a wall of paint..

I am a scenario player and I run it with a gas thru t-stock with a remote and a Halo too loader.. super light setup... I love it..

Matt

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 11:53 AM

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Mini For Scenario?

by RA

Your set up sounds cool. Does anyone rip on you for not using a "real scenario gun"?

I enjoy woodsball but I'm not a hardcore about being milsim so I'd use any electro I might find for such play. I figured some backlash may occur since I
wouldn't be carrying a Tippmann, etc.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:41 PM

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probably depends on the crowd

by ydna

I know lots of guys that use their "flashy" speedball guns (ie...not black/grey/olive) out there in the bush. Granted they probably aren't the ones that are chest-deep out in the swamp, but still happy.gif It might look odd to use a marker like that but it would probably depend on the crowd as to whether or not it was a faux-pas at that particular field.

But then again if you end up with a marker that's not mega flashy looking, such as a simple one-color scheme or even a darker color, it certainly wouldn't hurt since that makes a crawl through the bush all the more appealing.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 6:53 PM

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Is the Mini up to crawling and such?

by RA

I play pretty aggressively even in my old age. Speedball is one thing but is that Mini durable enough for thrashing around in the woods? Crawling, diving, mud etc?

Rob

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:08 PM

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Re:Chest deep in swamp

by Gunslinger

hey, as long as the gun is above water it's fine no matter what you use. Note to self, do the chest deep thing again with my promaster.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:26 PM

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Well...

by BigMatt-MadCustoms

Well it is one of the nice Olive color ones that came out a few years back.. happy.gif SO it kinda blends in real nice...

I am not to hard core when it comes to being milsim either..this old fart is starting to realize that lighter is better..

Matt



Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 1:43 AM

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Another for the Mini

by Raff-E

Got one the first day and I love the thing. It's funny when the full loader and air are both heavier than the gun.

Only had one issue that was a manufacturing error. Never put any "upgrades" on it or even changed the board.

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 12:14 PM

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PMR and Mini both excellent choices.

by Joey

The only downside to an electronic gun is that it can require more upkeep than a Tippmann 98. with a PMR, I would probably break it down and clean it after every couple days of play, or if it had a particularly messy day, clean it after every day of play. (It may seem like alot, but given that you will have spent hundreds of dollars on this marker, it can't hurt to make sure it's well taken care of, obviously.)
Good luck in your search!

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 12:41 PM

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better than 98's

by Gunslinger

cleaning-wise that is. with a PMR all you have to do is unscrew the back cap and pull out the bolt assembly and relube it on occasion. total strip time at end of day, five minutes if you are really slow.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:21 PM

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I hear Auto-Cockers are pretty high-tech. I think some even take batteries. [nt]

by IDN

"I make funny"

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 1:12 PM

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X7 Phenom

by Jeb Hoge

I'm very interested in seeing how these do once they're in widespread use. I really like the concept (even if it has been done before).

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 1:17 PM

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holy budget figures batman!

by Gunslinger

x7 Phenom = $400 starting. not friendly to wallets.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 5:02 PM

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Re: X7 Phenom

by Or the marker it poorly ripped off, the Mag.

If you're going to drop that much cash on a marker, you might as well toss in the extra and get the better gun.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 2:05 AM

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*eyeroll* Oh really?

by

I loved the E-Mag and have utmost respect for Tom Kaye, but last I checked, E-Mags didn't come with bolt-synced air-powered hoppers, hoseless bottomlines, a huge array of mil-sim body hardware, and unless I'm mistaken, there probably aren't a ton of functional E-Mags available at the Phenom's price point. And the ones that you can find probably don't run CO2 out of the box like the Phenom is supposed to.

Posted on Nov 3, 2009, 4:17 PM

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Thanks for the help!

by RA



Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 5:42 PM

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TWB "I thought you said this was going to be thrilling."

by Nighthawke

So did I Doc. I think someone's not going to be allowed back into the shop for awhile

But If it were not Jinx that was grabbing the others, then who?

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 8:35 AM

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Someone who's had a long day, that's who. nt

by D D

No Trick-or-treaters

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 8:47 AM

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Now I see.....

by Ketira

Howie grabs and tosses to Doc, who catches and puts them in his truck.


I also liked the footnote! Cute! wink.gif

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 3:22 PM

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love the foot note Doc

by

way to break the 4th wall....

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 2:41 PM

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I 2nd that! Laugh at you own joke all you want! nu txt

by

so... how might an Emancipator work with a "cheater" setup?


Omg ! That's still on clipboard?!?

Posted on Nov 1, 2009, 10:05 PM

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Under the hood of the new X7

by

Oh man, christmas came early! The UPS man just made his rounds and stopped outside my house. I certainly wasnt expecting one of these to show up on my step this soon. So it looks I get to show everyone inside Tippmann's new "flex valve" system. Most everyone thats interested has seen the basic field strip in videos and pictures, but nobody was showing the inside of the valve.

So some first pics...Unboxed and put together. Initial impressions, its way lighter than the regular X7. Its also much shorter as advertised. In terms of feel, its definately very high on my list of nice milsim type guns. It also seems like Tippmann decided to spiff out a few bits that I wasnt aware needed spiffing. The push pins have a black dust ano job now instead of the glossy ano. Also its worth mentioning the first new stock barrel ever for a non-98 Tippmann. At least Im pretty sure, and thank god. The ancient middle-ported barrel that was stock since the Pro-Am was showing its age. The new stock barrel seems to have a nicer internal bore, and tight grouped porting at the tip.

I didnt get any pictures of the reciever halves split open, because honestly theres absolutely nothing in there. The only 2 parts inside the reciever halves is the ball detent and the barrel adapter. Also interestingly, since the design doesnt require smooth sliding surfaces for a rear bolt, the entire inside of the reciever halves is hollowed out for weight reduction.

[linked image]



And field stripped. Not much to say here, it comes apart fast thats for sure. One worry I noticed is the extra "push pin" that retains the valve in place is plastic. A bit odd, considering it has a pretty narrow neck in the middle.

[linked image]



The trigger group is interesting, and a fairly clever layout. In manual mode, the area of the trigger that intersects the safety sinks into a slot cut into the safety. In electro mode, the trigger is sortof "half-stopped" by the safety, so it cant engage the "sear" or whatever the term for the piece on the right is. In mech mode, the top of the trigger lifts the "sear" and that piece in turn presses a simple on/off type valve in the bottom of the main valve. In electro mode, the "sear" is actuated by the solenoid. Pretty standard stuff. Now heres where it gets weird....

[linked image]

[linked image]

I have absolutely no idea how switching the safety to electro mode activates the board...I really really dont. Theres no physical switch on the board except for the mode select button. The board detects the trigger using 2 hall effect switches at the top that detect 2 magnets set in the bottom rear sides of the trigger. Also notice in the trigger picture that the area with the magnets is adjustable in some fashion by a set screw in the trigger. Im not exactly sure what it adjusts, most likely fire sensitivity, because this isnt mentioned at all in the manual. Im already imagining plenty of folks messing with that set screw and throwing the sensitivity out of whack, then getting utterly confused because its not in the manual.

I like the fact that they added the plastic frame to the board. Should prevent folks from knocking components off.

Also check out the nifty brass internal hardline. Someone must have had fun programming the bender to crank THOSE out...


Well here goes with the valve. I like the way they decided to just make the thing completely self contained. Its a bit fun to open up all the way, all that it requires is removing the velocity adjuster, unscrewing the rear housing with a crescent wrench, and everything drops out the back.

[linked image]

Its a bit of an interesting method. From what I can figure, the rear spool (second from left) functions as the on/off on a mag does, shutting the source off once the dump chamber is charged. The main spool (first on the left) plugs the powertube, and works like a balanced spool valve. The trigger valve on the bottom simply adds enough pressure on one side to pull the spool back, opening the dump chamber to the powertube. Also along the way in the firing cycle, at the very end of the bolt extension, a small internal hole is opened, which operates the cyclone feed.

Most of the weight of the reciever comes from the brass regulator piston and the velocity adjuster. Theyre both pretty hefty for their size.

Its pretty amusing the way they plugged the holes that were used to drill the internal air passages in the valve. And theres a lot of them, someone put some time into thinking of how to physically build this into a self contained unit.



Overall Im pretty damn impressed. Im not even sure how to classify it, a blow forward spooler with a sear tripper e-grip that doesnt actually use a sear?



Posted on Oct 30, 2009, 2:26 PM

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Wow if that doesn't scream E-MAG r.e.

by

Some one spent allot of time reverse engineering an E-Mag.

As far as how the safety controls the board. Is there a magnet in the end of the selector lever?

I love seeing old ideas form 10 years ago get repackaged as new. Now all they need to do is make a removable warp feed to lock into and feed through the clip. That could be the Thompson SMG model


brian

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 11:15 AM

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Actually...

by Enos Shenk

Im not sure why people are confusing it with an e-mag. Other than the blow forward and the e-grip its completely different. It operates more like an invert mini than anything.

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 12:32 PM

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Re: Actually...

by Razgriez

Enos Shenk of the Tippmann boards, from the old red (back when the A-5 was the latest)? Knight of Fire from then, been a few years man good to see you posting here.

anyways, this whole news with the Phenom is kind of interesting though... I was hearing from many a declining trust with Tippmann products.

But still I like this new idea... I may trade in my old X-7 for a Phenom version... I take it that it still accepts A-5/X-7 threaded barrels?

Posted on Oct 31, 2009, 7:38 PM

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Yes, same barrel adapter system as X7

by Beest

The same barrel adapter system as X7, so it will take flatlines too.

Posted on Nov 2, 2009, 8:42 AM

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good

by Razgriez

The one thing that always makes me hesitant about investing alot of money into a single paintball marker, is the whole "Well this is great and all, but when the next shiny new version comes out, all 100-250+ dollars of barrels, triggers, stocks, and what's not will be obsolete" concern

and from the looks of it, the new Magazine/fake ammo clip looks a little more sturdy. That was a major gripe I had with the regular X7. The clip looked nice... but the durability of the retention system frankly sucked. especially considering it was designed as a small "tool kit" storage. Lost my stock X7 mil-sim clip within 15 minutes into the first scenario event I went to with it

Posted on Nov 4, 2009, 1:14 PM

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