So, just got back from taking my last son to college and feel like I have been crying for two weeks. But, the tears and pain go far beyond seeing my baby leave home.

I feel such regrets about my life, that I wasted so much of it being deluded and humiliated. I feel like I wasted so many of the years with my sons because I was so distraught and distracted by my H, his alcoholism and his bi-polar cruel/romantic persona - for those seven years I had no idea he was having A's, though all the signs were there.

Seeing all those beautiful, hopeful college freshmen made me want to start all over and make better decisions about my life. Then, I got really sick and wondered how many of those bright young faces would face the trauma of adultery in their lives. Or, how many of the parents in the matriculation ceremony were either a BS or an WS. I don't want the A's to take over my life but it seems they have put their tentacles into everything.

Went from Boston to visit my brother in his trigger filled home. (Last time we were there was pre D Day but H had acted very strange and I knew something was wrong.) I told H and he was understanding and held me.

Then, on the way home, there was an exit for the town where H's most sordid A took place and that put me over the edge. I asked H if he was triggered by it and he said that he didn't even think of it. And, he was controlling himself but I could see he was angry and said something like, "we are both hurting right now about leaving M at college - can you just leave the A's out of it? I am not that person anymore and I don't want to continually be reminded of the despicable person I was." I believe he is struggling with wanting a drink today - he got very drunk when first son left for college and I have to be sensitive to his need for serenity - just part of the deal in deciding to live with an alcoholic.

So, part of me went into a rage, part of me understood and even agreed what he was saying and the only sane part of me came here to get it out. I think it was Tom who said that all roads lead to the A's and that is so true for me - I want a different set of directions or I fear I will drive myself mad and destroy what H and I have worked so hard to re-build. I also have to recognize that son's leaving is making me see everything through a very sad lens today.

Hey, Susan. I'm so sorry for all the hurt that you've been having to dodge. Things have been pretty emotional here, too, and I'm getting the same sort of, "I just want to get on with it. Why do you keep wanting to talk about the A? Why do I have to keep looking at what I did?" And like you, I'm going through that same split personality stuff of understanding the shame spiral and being furious that H put me in this position.

Wish I could take you out for a drink or dessert and just hash through some of this stuff, and vent, and cry and laugh. I'm feeling so fried.

Woof. I really didn't want to just dump on your post. I'd much prefer to have words of wisdom and comfort, but the rollercoaster has me on some pretty loopy spots right now.

All that said, congratulations to your wonderful boy and his exciting new chapter in life. I do that same thing where I look at the faces around me. Its hard to stay in the joy of the moment when so many of us know the percentages of people that are flush in the middle of all of this. Its heartbreaking. And its stolen moments, because we should be able to be rejoicing with our kids and focussed on them.

Hugs to you, friend. I wish there was more I could do or say. But I understand. Boy! Do I understand. BlueIris

"We cannot wait for the storm to pass; we must learn to walk in the rain."

((((((((((Susan)))))))))))

I face the prospect of my oldest son going off to college next year and I know I will be a big basket case. The truth is my WH didnt spend much time with our son throughout his l7 years. I wonder if he will have any regrets, knowing that he spent our sons most imformative years (11 years old to 16 years old) cheating not just on me, but cheating our son (and our other 2 children) out the precious time he should have been spending with him (them)instead of OW and her son. I fear, whether me and WH are together or not, I will feel much the same way as you do right now. I truly feel this is normal for most parents, as a child going off to college and leaving the nest is a time for refelction.

I know the biggest regret that I have is putting up with my WH's ill behavior of me. I cannot control what he did/does. But I know that I am a good mother and that I have always been there for my children, and I always will be. Family is the most important thing in the world to me.

Regardless of your H's alcoholism or not, you should be able to tell him how you are feeling. I feel that is not the same as blaming. It is simply communicating. But I understand your need to help him feel safe, and not give him reason to drink. I dont know if alcoholism and substance addiction are the same chemical responses in the brain because I dont know much about alcoholism, but I do know that an addict will conjure up any excuse to justify his use. Just as a WS will conjure up some reason why they feel the need to cheat. What I am trying to say is if he feels the need for a drink it will be because of the process of his addiction to alcohol that is going on inside of him and his need for a way to escape what he is feeling, and not because you are triggering. That is his demon to fight, but I undertsand you are trying to help him fight it by not contributing further to it. But he did this to himself so please do not think you have any control over it that's all. No more than I have control over my WH's addiction or his choice to cheat. But I feel you did the right thing for you, which is all any of us can do...you said how you felt...he said how he felt...and you left it at that. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

This is the part that concerned me:

<<I think it was Tom who said that all roads lead to the A's and that is so true for me - I want a different set of directions or I fear I will drive myself mad and destroy what H and I have worked so hard to re-build. I also have to recognize that son's leaving is making me see everything through a very sad lens today.>>

I do believe that after an A all roads lead to the A, as Tom said. I think that is true for most of us. I dont see that just going away, but perhaps fading in time...lots of time!!! So please allow time to do it's thing. And whether you see it or not, your direction has changed. Look where the two of you are now comapred to back then. You have both come a long way! You both decided to work on the marriage and rebuild. Just try to remember Rome was not built in a day. It took a solid foundation to be formed first. I am sure a few things toppled here and there, and I feel setbacks are normal, but no way do I think the two of you will destroy everything you have painstakingly rebuilt. You simply will not allow that to happen. The marriage means too much to both of you, and that my friend is obvious. I think it's like you said, you are just sad today...and rightfully so. I am sure your WH understands that too from teh sound of it.

(((((((((((hugs))))))))))))




~ CAL
"You, yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe, deserve your love and affection" ~ Buddha

Susan,

One day, most of those roads will stop leading to the A. And the ones that still do, will become managable. I just wanted to reassure you it won't always be like this.

Ami

Thank you, Dear Blue,Cal and Ami,

Once again, I am reminded of how remarkable the people here are and how much it means to just have people to talk to who truly understand.

I am sorry, Blue, that you are on the ride today. And, like you, all I can really offer is understanding. I think that part of the reason we struggle so much is that we are empathetic and can see the situation from the pov of our H's, a characteristic that my H was truly lacking until recently - I totally get that he wants to move on and not roll around in the dirt. I have told him that I don't want him to feel shame but that I need to talk about it. For the most part, he is just amazing in his willingness to listen and offer hugs. But, I know he wants to move on and every now and then, his frustration shows. He has now, two years later, taken the stand that he will no longer talk about the details - he has been over all that he can remember a million times and he just can't do it anymore. And, yes, I understand and yes, I get furious.

I do think that I am at the point when I really need to ask myself if I need to talk to H or if WE are better off if I don't. You are a year behind me - I remember that at Year 1, we were still going at it a good percentage of our time together. I think it is really important to get it out but that doesn't necessarily mean going at my H - I have a couple of friends who know and I have this wonderful place.

And, Cal, you are always so wise. Addictions, as you know so well, are cruel and demonic. I know that I cannot control his drinking (and that knowledge was hard to come by) but I also feel that I can help him in his sobriety the way that he is helping me with my recovery. Just really hard to know when I am allowing his needs to trump mine. I have a tendency to let that happen and then get mad at him when I do.

And, you have identified my core issue - the abandonment fear that he will leave me.....if I am not smart enough, not beautiful enough, too demanding, too needy, talk too much about the A's, etc. I am working on this and sometimes feel like I have a firm grip on self esteem and then I fall down. Thanks for reminding me to hold on tighter.

And Ami - so good to hear your "voice" - and thanks for the reassurance. Your perspective means a lot and gives me hope.

I would so love to go out for a drink with all of you (and yes, I drink, though not when alone with H, though I do when we are out with friends and he is fine with that). Any trips planned to NYC?

Susan,

just sending you big (((((hugs)))) right now because I am not home...will try to reply later tonight or tomorrow.

Pat

"Time is precious, but truth is more precious than time."

Susan,

The addictive behavior that your H faces is all tied up in his self esteem...as he works thru his guilt and managing his addiction you are seeing a different man, better man than the one who had the A...I really try not to look back but focus on today..read the book the NOW by E. Tolle...and the book THE PRESENT... will help you.

At five yrs out I can say that my H substituted one addiction for another...healthy eating, bike riding, etc...are his addictions today...he gets wrapped up in what he does, that is part of his personality..my daughter mentioned this week that it was good that he isn't addicted to alcohol..we all accept him as he is.

The different set of directions will happen for you, give yourself time...

Empty nest has hit your house...what plans are you and your H going to make to help you thru this time...so important for your relationship to work thru this together. I now meet friends for breakfast..do me things too..

We (H and I ) did and still do things together...the market, cooking, try new recipes, movies, .. enjoy and make the time work for you and your H. Focus those addictive genes on positive actions that you can be happy with.

Today we are at the beach early this morning some of the family ( 2 daughters and family) just left with 3 of our grandchildren( ages 9, 3, and 3 months)...H and I just said OHHHHHH peace and quiet. . the next family arrives next week with the 2 yr old and 5 month old..

(((((hugs)))))

Pat






"Time is precious, but truth is more precious than time."

Pat is right, New Empty Nesters find it is quite an adjustment. I tell everyone when they ask me what it is like that is the most horrible and wonderful time. Susan I too faced an Empty Nest while still copeing with my H's Infidelity. When it rains it pours, but you will muddle through as I did.

Good news though, one of my most difficult aspects of becoming an Empty Nester is that my oldest moved out of State, "9 HOURS AWAY!" Last night he unloaded his belongings into my garage. He is home! YAY! Life is cycles, the good cycles will come as surely as the bad.

Ami

Thank you for the words of comfort. Actually, I had been looking forward to being child-free and the freedom to do what we want without considering what the kids needs are. Still, it was quite a shock to come home to the "empty nest."

H and I have been doing lots on our own, an effort we have made since D Day, 2 years ago. We go out every Saturday night to his AA meeting and then to dinner. We have made more plans with friends as I no longer consider him a social liability and have gotten tickets to some events - plays, concerts. We are celebrating our 25th anniversary in December and have decided to take a special trip somewhere - I have such mixed feelings about celebrating as so much of our marriage was lived as a lie. But, we made it and mostly, I think that is worth celebrating.

My sadness today is more related to feeling that the A's not only robbed me of what was mine but also took away from my life with my children. During the time of his active alcoholism and A's, I was either distracted, worrying about where he was, what he was doing, his safety or I was screaming at him for being so irresponsible and mean. In both cases, he was the focus and I often wandered around the house in a depression. For the last 2 post D Day years, I have been so focussed on my pain, my anger, our recovery that I think my children got short shrifted. So added to all the other A garbage, I am now feeling that I lost precious years with my kids because of H's despicable decisions. It is hard to be angry at H because he feels such tremendous guilt and shame about how his behavior affected the kids.

But, at the same time, I know that I had a choice then - I didn't have to accept his abuse and behavior. Then, I wasn't able to make the right choice but today, I think I could.

And, in the end, I have two great sons, both of whom have learned that life can be tough but that it is possible to deal with bad things and come out stronger.Neither son knows about the A's but they know about the alcoholism and are very proud that their Dad has dealt with that demon - they did hear the screaming and I know they feel safer in the more peaceful, loving home we live in today. Now, if I could feel safe, that would be progress!

Susan,

You can not go back and change the past..We learn from the past. Look at your sons...keep telling them you love them and make sure that if the freshman or the older one in college is homesick that you make a trip to his college ASAP... send cookies, candy, special treats. some cute cards help ...let each boy know that you are available to them. My son called me at 1:30 AM...just to talk, and he knew that was OK because he needed to talk to me ...even if the conversation was about nothing..It was I need my mom or homesick..

Do plan a special trip...celebrate all the good stuff that is happening in your life right now...the 25th anniv...well I just don't make a fuss about them. I might think about the 50th if we both get there. Celebrate the life of your boys.

Keep your focus on Today...and today you are in a so much better place...

((((hugs)))

Pat



"Time is precious, but truth is more precious than time."