Well, I wrote a longish post and then somehow lost it. Something came up about the forum being optimized. I will try to write again a little later. Not doing well at all. Glad to be back to where I can write to you all.
Cathy, I guess every time someone responds to me at all on this forum it's like a little shot of hope. It makes me feel understood and not so alone. I don't really know your particular situation but I think there are over-riding universals in all this. I'm just starting on year 2 in recovery and I am SHOCKED by the waves of despair that will sweep over me very regularly still. I just look for tiny evidences of progress and I guess just have to see that time is doing SOMEthing. I feel the pain in your short note and wish I could help.
Have you shown your spouse the wikiAnswers.. "how to rebuild your spouse's trust after an affair."? It was a turning point for us.
I hope my thoughts are helpful, I'm thinking of you right now w/caring.
Thank you for being here at all, every single person that participates creates a chain of hope I think.
Good luck, Deb
Also the u-tube mens brains womens brains. The other best thing for us.
Very sorry to hear that you're not doing any better than when you left. I'm also sorry you lost your post. It stinks when that happens. Just as a suggestion, maybe type your post into a Word document and then copy/paste it into HH's forum, that way if something happens, you can still repost at another time.
I thought you were going to be gone for at least a month. It's really hard to do any recovery when you don't have any interaction or feedback. Not sure if that is why you returned or other reasons. But, it helped me to have a place to go where I could still get home when I wanted. I rented a room from a friend. I was her first renter so it gave her a chance to set up her house and try it out for awhile before bringing a stranger in. Anyways, I was close to work and just my regular commute away from home. It was a great way to get away "from his face" as you said, but still rebuild the relationship with spontaneous visits, phone calls, and e-mail. It doesn't work for everyone logistically or financially but it did for me.
Please take care of yourself, try to find and enjoy some moments of peace. Your journey, whatever path you may follow is supported by many.
Hello to all of you, my only true friends, as opposed to Job's friends, who could only tell him what HE had done wrong or give DUMB advice.
I have had too much to drink, but that seems to be the only way I can sleep these days. The main tHing is that I feel so TRAPPED. If i rage at H, what good does that do and if I rage at God, so what? NOTHING can change what H did to me and I'm SURE he is still glad he had all that great sex for 5 years the f--ing b----rd. It doesn't matter HOW badly he feels now. NOTHING can change what he did to me. I wish someone was dead, but that doesn't do any good either, because I have two little grandsons who would not understand if I was gone so I can't leave. So here I am, just a heap of grief and anger and horrible rage. Is there any help for me, please????
A person who feels trapped will try to find a way out, but I can't see any way out and I'm so hopeless. Please help me....
I am so sorry you are hurting so bad. I have been exactly where you are, and I can honestly say it can get better. Thoughts of suicide plagued me much of my first year after learning of my husbands affair. Like you, it was the effect my killing myself would have on the ones I loved that kept me from doing it, that and journaling endlessly. And let us not forget the friends I made on the internet who understood and could validate my feeling.
Try not to drink, it really doesnt help. I went down that road too for awhile. It seemed I couldnt get through the day with out a class of wine or two or three etc. When I realized my dependence was growing, I stopped because I had enough problems with out adding alcoholism to the mix. Instead, do some nice things for yourself. If you arent already find a good IC to help you through this. Be choosy finding a therapist, the right one is essential, and the wrong one devastating.
I hope you find a little relief from the pain each day. When you do, hold onto it and remember it. Eventually you will see that you get more and more moments that are better. This is a baby stet process, but it is one that you can make your way through and reclaim your life.
Another thing. I usually type my posts out in my word processing program and then copy and paste them to the Message Box. This way I don't time out. And if something goes wrong and it doesn't work, I still have everything I wrote safe, and can try posting it again.
Cathy as much as it hurts right now.. it will hurt less next year and the year after.. we have all been there and all i can say as will everyone else the hurt does lessen with time.
Right now you need to heal yourself.. you know that the A had noting to do with you.. it was the selfish action of a man who only thought about his own self.. you were NOT part of the decision, you are not to blame for anything.. it is all about your S.
Please don't think about being gone.. as you said it hurts so many innocent people especially our children and grandchildren.. please call your IC and let him help you thru this patch.. I bought a puppy when I was a month past D-day.. I exercised, walked, and spent time with my family, especially my grandson.. I only had one then.. I took care of me.. that was what important.. we all want the pain to be gone.. it has now been 7 years since D-day 2 and I never even thought about the date this year .. the day just passed..
just sending you big hugs of understand,
(((((hugs))))
Pat
"Time is precious, but truth is more precious than time."
My H's friends simply told him he was an idiot for admitting he'd had an A. Great help
I wanted to drink myself stupid and jump off the roof on D-day. My H had to call one of my friends to rescue me. I'm not even sure I would have, or could have jumped, but I remember just wanting the pain to end immediately. The thoughts and images were just too much.
I have found that when I drink too much wine, my emotions run away from me. I seem more vulnerable to recall vivid, albeit sad, images that overwhelm my good senses. I would sob and sob uncontrollably, and my H would comfort me, and wait out my rages. Then it was my turn to apologize to him, but he insisted I did not need to apologize. That if not for his terrible choices, I would never have been placed in that position.
Your feelings of being "trapped" are understandable. During your H's A, you were powerless - if was he who conducted that scene without your knowledge or consent.
Now, you still feel stuck between the rock and the hard place. Boy, I know that feeling well. Nothing you DO seems to make the pain go away. It's with you 24/7.
You drink: still have pain.
You think: still have pain.
You eat well/exercise: the pain still exists
You want to call OW and blast her, You want to blast H, You want to SCREAM, but still the pain is there.
I am so sorry for your pain. It takes a LONG time for it to ease, then longer for it to go away. But there ARE respites from the pain!
To help the pain, you must know - and I think it's #1 - that your H had an A NOT because of you or your M. It was HIS problems, HIS issues. I believe that my H continued to love me during his A, but clearly did not show loving behaviors. He simply shut me and our life OUT of his mind. When he didn't, he experienced ulcers or he confessed (twice that happened). He hadn't mastered his compartmentalizing well enough at that time. His guilt would eat at him.
When you realize the A was your H's fault entirely, then you should also remember that OW could have been ANYONE. Your H - for whatever issues - was vulnerable to have an A - the OW was simply available and willing. Two weaknesses connected and you became the outsider.
Your grief, anger, and rage are all logical reactions to having been betrayed. As time passes, you will be able to handle your emotions better, and see the A from afar, yet clearly. Right now, you are on that scary roller coaster ride we all know too well. I wanted to get off immediately, but it kept on going without my wanting it to. Even when I'd scream with pain, it continued. The lulls were welcomed, even though the ride continued. Embrace the low part of the ride; they will sustain you and make you believe that there will be a time when the ride slows down considerably, and eventually, stops.
It will, Cathy. We are here to testify to that. But it also wont happen soon, or suddenly. You need to ride it out.
In the meantime, please take care of yourself. Right now, YOU matter most. If you need to scream, find a screaming spot. Need to talk? Talk with your H, find a friend, come to HH, or get a therapist to help you figure things out. Keep your body and mind strong by being kind to it: eat, exercise, limit your alcohol.
Oh, and one last thing - for me this was VERY hard to do at first because it involves controlling emotions. When you ask your H for raw honesty in answering your questions, remember you want the TRUTH. You have ASKED the question, and if he answers it honestly, try to control your emotions. I remember asking H all kinds of things during our reconciliation, and he'd answer them honestly, but hearing/knowing the facts ate my heart out and I'd fly into a rage. Eventually, I'd learn to listen and accept. Big sigh. It was very hard for me to do that, but then, I did want to know the answers.
I'm sorry this was so long, Cathy. My heart aches right now for the pain you are in; I remember it so well.
JJ
Peace is not just the absence of war; it's an exercise in compassion. -Dalai Lama
Coming to you from JJ
I feel so humiliated about my behavior last night, but my H loved me anyway and knows that lunatic is not really me. The alcohol has to stop and will. I can be plenty angry without that and communicate quite well about my grief and hopelessness, and the worst feeling of all . . . being trapped. Don't want a divorce, don't want to be alone, can't run away or die and it all really DID happen. I think I am still fighting that acceptance. I am going to Al-Anon meetings because my H was drinking during the A, but now it is I who am having problems with it. The first sentence of the Serenity prayer is "God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change". I can't seem to be able to get past that.
Thank you ALL for your continued encouragement, wisdom and assurance that it will get better. I will call my IC today and let him know about this meltdown. He is always able to help me put things in perspective a little better. Today I will TRY to do just today and not think about anything else.
Dear Cathy,
Nine years ago I first came here. I too wanted to die. I used to say I felt lower than the scum on the bottom of ow's shoe.
I truly did.
Writing here many many many times a day and reading all the healing books that are listed on the left,and reading everything on dearpeggy.com is what got me through the worst hell I could never imagine. Healing is agony that has no words.
It was the people who were here before me, the "old timers" who reached out to me and told me in TIME it would get better. It was becaues of their loving words that I held on to life.
I thought of my children and how they would hurt knowing what their father did that caused me to want to die. I could not allow my agony to cause them such horrible grief. I needed to live for them.
Today I am so grateful I chose life. I have healed beyond my wildest dreams. I never thought I could feel human again.
I am here to tell you we all know your pain so very very well. We truly have walked in your shoes.
We know how to help you. We know what you are feeling.
Please listen to all the loving words of wisdom my dear friends have written. It was their kindness that has gotten each one of us to a safe place.
It takes a lot of hard work and time. How long since d day for you? What good work have you done to heal you?
You are responsible ONLY for your healing. He is responsible for his healing. IF the marraige is to survive, he must carry the heavy load until you are ready to deal with the healing of the marraige. Before that can happen YOU must start to heal.
Healing happens when you stop drinking and start taking care of you. Exercise, eating right, reading the healing books, talking to the right people, and getting your feelings out with people who truly understand is how healing happens.
My best friend told me it " is 6 months already, get over it"
when I said the same things here at healing I was told " take as long as you need, don't be hard on yourself, feel your feelings, and share your pain with us".
You can not ignore your feelings. You are suffering from Post Traumatic Stress. The best way to deal with that is to write, talk and just get the poison out. Check out Dr. Shirley Glass' website and read her interview. That was one of the best articles I read to understand what I was feeling.
Accpetance of what happened takes a long time. Right now you are in shock and denial. That is NORMAL. Do not try to rush your feelings. Just share and know you are never a burden here. We write because we care.
I've been thinking about you all morning, and something else just came to my mind. I'm sure you don't really care about his pain right now, as you have so much of your own...but please hear me out.
And to the rest of the HH community, I share this knowing it was just OUR circumstance; I don't know if anyone else experienced it:
Cathy, when you say:
NOTHING can change what H did to me and I'm SURE he is still glad he had all that great sex for 5 years the f--ing b----rd: I felt the same way...even jealous.
But he truly NEVER did anything TO you. He did it entirely TO and FOR himself. You were not part of the formula. In fact, he probably had himself convinced you'd never find out.
But it's taken me years to know that it was not all fun and games for my WS. He was in pain the entire time:
playing a mask game that made him lie...to me, to our kids, even to her to continue the game.
He had just turned 60 and had turmoil rolling throughout him. Much pain he could not deal with: the loss of both parents in a year, empty nest, looming retirement, and inevitable major surgery.
Aging; something my H does not take well - a former athlete proud of his strong body, but now starting to age...
And...you'll probably think this weird, but his incapacity to make love with me without the use of pills. It didn't seem to matter that he needed them with her, but with ME, he felt deficient.
I know now, that during his A, he was also in agony. Guilt. Fear of the future. Fear of being discovered. He drank a lot when he was home to forget what he was doing. I didn't see it that way at first, and it's taken me a long time to understand that he was in pain, too.
I know that now; I didn't then. And truly it didn't even matter to me then, because all I could feel was my pain. It's only now, after time and his honesty and remorse, that I can feel his sorrow for his actions. My H is definitely NOT "glad" that he had all that "great sex." Because sex is just a human function when there's no love. It was just a shallow game to prove to himself that he was still a "man." That he could still be found "attractive." They called it love; but he knew, deep in his heart that it wasn't. Love is not just sex in a hotel; that's lust.
I love him now for having the courage to be honest. To deal with his own pain - and not harboring on it - to help ease mine. After the A, he knew he needed to deal with his demons - but not by having sex with another woman. That only made more demons. He made awful choices that damn near ruined our family; he lives with that every day.
You'll eventually step off that roller coaster and see that you're okay. You'll have gained and lost. Hopefully your gains will outweigh your losses.
Dear Cathy,
Since you got here, I have so related to the feelings you have expressed and that continues to be the case. I could have written (and actually think I did) many of the things you did. We are now 4 years post D Day and doing incredibly well.
4 years ago, I thought
-I would never, ever feel better, that there was no way to move get out of that dark, dark pit and move forward.
-I would never stop crying.
-I would obsess about it 24/7 for the rest of my life.
-The movies would never stop playing in my head.
-My husband got to have hot,exciting sex and that he was glad he had the experience.
-My husband got to have hot, exciting sex and then he was able to have a better M with me.
-I would always feel humiliated and inadequate.
-I didn't think I could get through another day and understood (but did not contemplate) the idea of suicide.
-I would despise the OW for always and continue to obsess about her and revenge forever.
-I interrogated my H daily for hours at a time and it felt more surreal and despicable with each revelation.
Then, we went through the horribly excruciating process of recovery - endless talking, MC, IC, screaming, yelling, sobbing, raging, loving, hating, divorce talk, love talk. It would seem like truly insane thinking and behavior to those who have not been through infidelities but to all of us here, it makes perfect sense.
Like you, alcohol was an issue for my H. He finally acknowledged the problem and sought help, from an Addicitions Counselor and from AA. I tried Alanon but couldn't find a group where I felt I fit in.
All of the above saved our M (particularly AA, which I attend with H regularly)and I can honestly say that our M is better than it ever was, even pre-A's.
Today, I am so different:
-I don't think about it all the time and when I do, there is a peculiar sense of disconnection - I can't believe I was that person or that my H did those things.
-I see the whole thing as sad for H and OW - they both needed admiration and conquest so badly that they lowered themselves in disgusting ways.
-OW are not a sexy, exciting creatures. They are very damaged women. I don't forgive them but I don't care about them, either.
-I deserved so much more and will never settle for less again.
-If there is ever a sign of disrespect, cheating or inappropriate behavior, it is over. There are no second chances for me and H knows that. (I admire the strength of the people here who could get through multiple D Days. I couldn't.)
-I am almost ready to change my name here to SelfEsteem Finder.
Here's the most amazing thing - D Day was on August 16. The day came and went and I didn't remember.
Change was very, very slow. I don't think I really started to get better until Year 3. Enough time had gone by that H had proved himself and the A's began to feel like the past and not my present.
So, that's a long winded way of saying that it is possible to recover but that it doesn't seem that way for a long time. There are so many wonderful people here who understand like no one else and who will always be here for you. Without Ami, EL, Pat and so many others, I don't know if I could have gotten "better".
Let me know if you want to chat here or offline about the alcohol thing but only if you want to.
JJ, you have written some awesome posts, but this truly is incredible! You have so lovingly and accurately expressed what so many of us here call healing.
His affair was not about you! It was his choice to solve a problem he was having. It takes each of us a long time to come to that understanding. In each case it involves lots of hard work to decipher the difference between a media perceived affair, and the reality of an affair.
On TV an affair is true love or hot passion. In reality as Dr. Shirley Glass used to say "it is not about not getting enough, but about not giving enough"
The betrayer was having his own problems and was not committed to the marraige. He/she was looking for an escape from reality. Some choose drugs, some gambling, some sex. Our husbands chose sex.
Dr. Wonderful used to tell me no matter who he married this would have happened. I could not understand that for a long long time. What helped me to understand that was coming here and talking to our wonderful former betrayers for years.
They constantly said the same thing year after year, new person after new person. At first it was Jim who told me this. I thought my husband some how found out about this site and was writing. However, I also knew Jim's wife as a betrayed member on the other board. I could not imagine my H going through such an elaborate effort to convince me of this. Then many others wrote expressing your words dear JJ the same words I heard from my H. This had nothign to do with me.
One of the guys here wrote any sex is good sex. Yet over the years of healing I learned that men think differently than women.
Last night we watched some stupid TV show( The Bank Job) where the hero slept with another woman. When his wife found out she was angry for about five minutes. Then it was all better. I was so upset last night. BUT.. my anger lasted about five minutes not the eternity it used to when I first came her. Anything used to set me off back then.. for a LONG LONG time.
That is cause healing does happen. But only with knowlege. With knowledge we get to acceptance. Accpetance is it DID happen. There is nothing I can do to change that. It is in the past. But who is he now, and who am I? We are not the same people.
Then comes understanding of WHY it happened. Without the why you do not feel safe. My H did lots of introspection and therapy to find out why. He never worked so hard at anything in his life. He prefers not to think about difficult emotional issues, but rather to just ignore them.
He learned if he wanted our marraige he had to do it my way. Completely emotional, and totally introspective. I needed us both to understand every breath he took with her.
JJ, reading your post makes me realize why I can't quit this place! Not only do we help ourselves when we write, but we help people we may never meet continue the endless process of healing.
I wish I could give you a hug - or share a virtual glass of wine with you (just one or two, of course).
Ive been worried about you, alone, away from your home, out of contact, trying to do cold turkey without your husband. How was it?
I too know I needed some space, distance, escape, but thought hell, this is MY home, HE breached it, HE can leave, I want to sleep in MY bed. And for me it would have been difficult to be apart for too long with no opportunity for dialogue with H when there is still so much discovery to be done, - as Mikka put it so well elsewhere about her solo retreat All it did was glare a sharp, unremitting light on how crummy I feel.
No wonder you needed meltdown when you came back, but contrarily it sounds like it was just what you needed, a release, a letting go - dont beat yourself up about it - meltdown is normal, not lunatic. Stop judging yourself. (and if youre a lunatic, welcome back to the lunatic asylum with the rest of us)
AND you let your husband love you through it and look after you. That is strength.
I remember wanting to be looked after, but not wanting to ask for it. I remember feeling resentful that he had not done the protect and honour bit but that I was still doing the in sickness and health, and for better for worse bits, resentful that I was doing all the looking after, all the understanding. But unable to stop.
Three weeks after wake-up call (D-day), I had to go overseas for two weeks to set up a project; this was a good thing, an escape, some space, the distraction of a team of people needing my guidance, the chance to focus on me and remember who I was, be with people who liked and loved me. But I knew I couldnt go into a vacuum of non-communication with H, so we kept up a constant email correspondence - late at night since I was working days and evenings. But the effort of all of this - no sleep, not being able to eat, vomiting up anything I managed to get down so subsisting entirely on hotel peanuts, keeping my secret and trying to be wise-cracking belle of the ball in the work with my colleagues brought on a kind of collapse/ panic attack after my final meeting - and I ended up in a foreign hospital on a heart monitor (nothing wrong with my heart, of course, it was just broken, and I was physically a wreck).
And so, I was doing a very poor job of looking after me; and realized I was going to have to give up some of the fierce independence onto which I was clinging by my fingertips for dear life. But that was very difficult for me - as you can see from some extracts from emails I sent him from abroad (background, he was still worried about her, wanting to comfort her as she was crying all the time, felt she was a victim of him, and at that time was also still in withdrawal and also wanted to be seen as Mr Nice Guy):
"I too have been burgled.
And your sacred (her name) is still trying to burgle me.
And you are letting her.
And you are letting her, not for her, as you think, but for yourself.
It feels to me today that everything is for yourself.
So I think perhaps that you deserve each other.
And I am beginning to think that you don't deserve me.
Since I am not sacred enough to you, that you don't care enough to protect me, to set standards and boundaries for yourself, to begin to think of ways of nourishing the tree, rather than sending more poison down to its roots, then I will have to protect myself, and set my own standards and boundaries."
----------------------
"The word home appears again and again I realise; in betweenst an intensive day, I realise I have been subconsciously been deliberating it as I consider leaving 'home'; and that I cannot and do not wish leave it, because 'home' is really 'just me', and I am happy with that home of 'just me'.
My second home is with you, with our secret world.
And my current 'home', that I am considering leaving, feels for now no longer a home, and so I know I must as you ask do some more re-membering."
"Please do not confuse me as either your best friend or your mother, because I am neither.
But it is true that I have been trying to take care of you, to look after you, I have tried every way to do this. I am still trying. Not for me, not for 'us', but simply for you. And that is love.
I see no corresponding effort, only a black hole that I keep trying to help you out of, but I am not going into the black hole with you.
You are just falling now, and hoping that someone will catch you. And I believe, and hope, that in time, and it will take time, it will be you that does the catching."
----------------------------------
If taken at that level of a choice between two women (rather than, as you say, a choice between the man you were and the man you want to be), it is galling to me that this choice is between one that is weak, with no standards and for whom I have no respect, and the other - that is me. It is galling that it is the 'dumsel' (a crude indulgence, I know) is the one you are deliberately choosing to protect and look after, and is the one that you are now going to run to looking for answers.
Is it partly that looking after her that makes you feel like a man?
What is it? Lack of love, care, compassion, empathy, emotional intelligence, selflessness or what, or the fact that I am somehow coping (emotionally and mentally very strong but now really really physically sick with all the effort of managing everything), that means that you are not trying to look after me, take care of me, protect me, or even thinking about it, as a man/ friend/ husband should? Do you not think I need looking after? How dare you not look after me!
Looking after myself is after all only another newly recently-acquired skill for me, just like the ukelele. And like the ukelele, it needs practice, and so every now and then it slips, and I make the mistake sometimes of hoping you will take care and protect me... and you don't...and you can't, because you are still asking me to look after you."
(It feels kind of funny -vulnerable and exposing - putting out above extracts of words that were private, but think they serve to illustrate the struggle I was having to steady myself on the rollercoaster, and the rapid cycling between my states of mind).
Anyway, I got out of hospital and arrived home in the middle of the night - after a gruelling, still vomiting all the way, 6 hour drive through fierce storms all the way from the airport - to a house filled with flowers, candles and soft music. Despite being on my last legs, still had enough spike in me to ask whos died?
But somehow, I had proved myself to myself - Id got the job done and Id survived what felt like hell, and so maybe now I could afford to be vulnerable, give myself a break and, most importantly, STOP judging myself.
And so whilst this ramble may all have been about me, Cathy, its just some words - about caring for and not judging yourself so badly all the time - words from a parallel rollercoaster, waving to you along the way, keeping you company, your waves keeping me company. Because I can see you waving Cathy, waving not drowning.
The words waving and drowning evokes for me other thoughts Ive been having about the rollercoaster.
It feels more like theres been a big storm out at sea some time ago (D-Day of course), the surges are underwater, the waves take a long time to surface and reach the shore, wave after wave rising and swelling, breaking on the sho
"Women are still getting concussion from hitting our heads on the glass ceiling, plus we're expected to windex it whilse we're up there". (Kathy Lette)
The words waving and drowning evokes for me other thoughts Ive been having about the rollercoaster. It feels more like theres been a big storm out at sea some time ago (D-Day of course), the surges are underwater, the waves take a long time to surface and reach the shore, wave after wave rising and swelling, breaking on the shore. Ive got to learn to see the swell under the water, duck, dive, and ride each one, no matter how choppy. I know too that some of the smaller underwater currents are from long ago, maybe even childhood. I know too that even if being very calm and collected in talking to H and hearing gory details that Ive asked for, that the wave of emotion about that detail will inevitably and eventually arrive 24 hours later, and that Ive got to be ready for it.
And, even if this means mixing my metaphors, I need to remind myself that Im a silkie and a strong swimmer.
Maybe because the bigger waves from my most recent D-day four weeks ago, are only just reaching the shore now, Ive been trying to think about the nature and allure of illicit sex.
Like you, (if I read your words correctly?) I could have been - ok, I admit WAS - envious (but not jealous) of the apparently fabulous sex they had.
And been trying to figure out - over and above the obvious aspects of the ego stroke - what the high of illicit sex is. And I think it is a high that is accumulative and progressive, but that will diminish through habit even if body memory reproduces echoes of the high.
The way I see it is, the first time, because its wrong, risky, dangerous, (exciting for all these reasons), ones body is already in a state of heightened alertness and arousal (not sexual, but fear), all sorts of hormones and adrenalin running to the rescue of the body, causing nerve endings to be more alert, the body more awake and acutely sensitised, and therefore the experience, the bodily perception of the sex is also heightened, every nerve ending responding in a new way. And that is why it feels different and good - not because it is better - but because of the rush of hormones, and the heightened sensitivity of the body being on guard. Well, thats my theory anyway.
"The Chair
I feel like that old torn-up and battered chair you see turned on it's side at the edge of the road. I was discarded there as if I had no value...just a useless piece of trash. He went searching for another chair...one that was newer...one that was more comfortable...one that could make him feel good. He tried many out. "
(an extract from someone Surviving Infidelity)
I remember not looking in mirrors after D-day, because ALL I could see were the multiplying wrinkles, dark shadows under the eyes, a sagging face. Because surely these were the things that caused the A?
OF COURSE, I knew otherwise - that it was HIS wrinkles, HIS sagging face that were to blame for the affair, not mine. But my face was a mirror in which he could see his own wrinkles and sagging face. Far better for him to look into the mirror of a young pretty single blonde and see his younger self reflected there in all its affair-luminescent glory. Yes?
No.
He couldnt look himself in the mirror. The whole thing was an escape - not just from routine, bills responsibility - from HIMSELF. Not a FINDNG of himself, a LOSING of himself. Further into the void he was trying to escape.
Now, when I look into the mirror, I focus on my smiley eyes.
And on the beach this summer, I even brazenly flaunted my stretch marks.
Brazenly and wantonly!
I started this post meaning to be brief, just to welcome you back, feeling that you had some fantastic responses already, but I seem to have rambled on as usual, sorry this is so long. (Maybe it was that metaphorical glass of wine in my system).
Give me a wave back, lovely Cathy.
Daisy.
"Women are still getting concussion from hitting our heads on the glass ceiling, plus we're expected to windex it whilse we're up there". (Kathy Lette)
I have this little thing I cut from a mag, it made me feel better somehow:
"'Although 'little white lies' may be less egregious than 'real' lies, they still-like all deception- involve some degree of victimization. If a lie succeeds, someone is always fooled. And, crucially, even if the target of the lie doesn't know this, the liar does. Research has shown that even white lying makes liars feel a little worse, and this coloring of mood can last even after the conversation has returned to more honest territory. The sum effect is what one researcher calls an emotional smudge on the interaction. Converstations involving lies are less warm, less intimate, less comfortable than those that are more honest.'"
For me, the point was, that as the AP is pretending (ie lying) that this relationship is valid, honest, and won't hurt anyone, well, no true intimacy is really possible. There is a carefulness, an inability to be candid, a hiding going on.
I like thinking it was all surface, nothing real. In my case the AP was super good at making it feel like she cared about us all (my H, my kids, even ME!) throughout it. Like she was coming from a caring place. CREEPY! I'm glad I'M not that person.
Deb, this magazine cutting is very true. And not just surface - but false - a false presentation of self. How could it be true self?
Certainly in the case of my husbands affair (i.e. OW17), they were both presenting the best of themselves to each other, (in an orgy of admiration and externalising affirmation), actually false selves then, just a performance of self; and as he wouldnt talk with her about me, our life and history, our friends, our daily life, the children - what did that leave for them to talk about? Just their work, in my Hs case. And, of course, the A itself, and how good each other made them feel.
I think the recognition of this lack of real intimacy, lack of real self and the real other, is felt by A partners (OPs and WSs), and why this lack needs bolstered by them by the Hollywood constructs, as El says above, of so-called true love/ hot passion - to reinforce the bubble that is in reality so false and fragile. And in most cases, Im guessing, certainly in my Hs, because the A is meant to be secret, and they cannot discuss it with anyone else except each other, and so they do, ad nauseam, and so, through that reflexivity, it becomes trapped in its own cocoon, and raises the temperature of the A even more.
Thanks
Daisy
"Women are still getting concussion from hitting our heads on the glass ceiling, plus we're expected to windex it whilse we're up there". (Kathy Lette)
I like thinking it was all surface, nothing real. In my case the AP was super good at making it feel like she cared about us all (my H, my kids, even ME!) throughout it. Like she was coming from a caring place. CREEPY! I'm glad I'M not that person.
My OM was the same way, made my ex feel like he really cared. OM was good at lying to others and sucking others into his way of thinking. He was a charismatic person, so you either hated him or liked him, there was no middle ground with him. And like all OPs, they tell the WS what they want to hear, to suck them into belieiving the lie. My OM actually said to me that he believed that affairs were GOOD for marriages and that those who deny it were deluding themselves. Talk about a sick and twisted person. YET, he couldn't remain married to a woman who constantly stepped out on him. Can we spell
H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E????
OPs will say and do anything to make you believe that they sympathize/empathize with you, when in reality, they don't. They are just in it for themselves and looking out for number 1.
Sadly, some of us are weak (WS) enough to be drawn into their lies, when most sane people can see through their transparency.
Daisy, here is your wave and my deep gratitude to you for sharing so much of yourself with me/us. I am on the run to a meeting right now and want to take plenty of time tomorrow to read and reread all that you and the others wrote; SO much compassion, insight and wisdom. Will be back in touch soon.
XXX
Cathy
I used to love the movie "The English Patient". Now, after this experience I watched it w/an entirely diff. point of view. If you've seen it...Colin Firth plays the betrayed spouse, an entirely kind, devoted, you name it...spouse. His wife "falls in LOVE" w/a man who, if you are looking critically at it, has no friends, is depressed, etc....but VERY ROMANTIC. I had watched it B and not questioned it a bit. I can't imagine being that stupid now. I imagined "them" actually living together and thought it would be no life because....IT'S BASED ON FANTASY!!! As Ms. Vaughn says, Infidelity is portrayed as romantic and common in our society.
A message we didn't even know we were getting.
Who in God's name would leave Colin Firth for ANYone else. He's Darcy after all!!!
Yes, so much fiction which romanticises affairs and plays along with the concept of the romantic couple who nobly give up their families for the sake of their perfect love (or heroically stay with an unloved spouse for the sake of their families). Very few of them have any real understanding of what it is really like in the wake of an affair. We watched Love Actually a week before D-day#1 and then again some months afterwards. I thought that it was a movie which showed something more realistic about affairs: all the tricks the WS had to play to spend time with the OW, but mainly how the BS felt when she suspected and then found out. And at the end, when he comes home from a trip, and she just can't let herself relax or be affectionate: there is that distance because he betrayed her. Some of the other romances in the movie are pretty unreal, but the portrayal of the affair hit the spot with me.
