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Down Under Evidence Of Underhand Scam "Statistics"

December 11 2003 at 11:30 PM
bogush  (Login bogush)
Forum Owner
from IP address 81.77.51.185

 
Tony Ryall: Snap...snap - and road toll goes up

12.12.2003
COMMENT

The Transport Minister, Paul Swain, has advertised a series of sweeping changes to speed-camera ticketing: lower tolerances, hidden cameras and demerit points. He says these will lower the road toll. The evidence says these won't make a jot of difference ... but will swell the Government's treasure chest.

At the start of this week, 431 New Zealanders had been killed on the roads, compared with 377 this time last year. Last year the road toll was 404.

Catching "speedsters" is the central plank of the Government's road-safety policy. Mr Swain said in June that "the most convincing argument supporting the police enforcement of speed limits is the declining rate of death and injury from road crashes".

What he didn't tell us was that 75 per cent of fatal accidents and 85 per cent of all crashes happen under the posted speed limit.

What we are never told is that despite the police issuing a record number of traffic tickets in the past year - almost 1.5 million - latest available data from the Land Transport Safety Authority shows that not only has the road toll gone up but there have been more crashes and injuries.

More tickets, more fines, more car confiscations and more advertising have not stopped more accidents.

We are now at a point where we must question the effectiveness of our road-safety policies.

When it comes to speed and accidents, the real speed issue is speed inappropriate for the conditions.

British researcher Alan Buckingham noted in a vital piece of work - predictably bagged by the LTSA - that "few would claim that driving 10km/h above the speed limit on an empty motorway in good conditions constitutes driving with excessive speed".

But driving just below the speed limit in fog and ice might constitute excessive speed.

Against this background, the Minister of Transport has been considering three changes to speed-camera policy. None takes into account the available research or international experience.

First, Mr Swain talked about lowering the speed camera tolerance level from 10 km/hh to 5 km/h over the posted limit.

This would generate tens of millions of dollars in additional revenue, but there is no evidence that these additional speed-camera tickets will do anything to improve road safety.

The latest data shows that 70 per cent of all speed-camera tickets are issued for driving 11 to 15 km/h over the limit. Drivers travelling 21 km/h or more over the limit make up less than 10 per cent of those ticketed.

Lowering the tolerance level to only 5 km/h over the posted limit would see hundreds of thousands of extra tickets issued to people who research says are the safest drivers - for no purpose other than extra tax.

Already a motorist gets a speed-camera ticket every minute of every day. The goodwill of law-abiding citizens towards the police would evaporate rapidly under such a regime as safe, but ticketed motorists feel unfairly treated.

In answer to a parliamentary question, the Police Minister, George Hawkins, last month indicated that the lower-tolerance idea "probably won't be Government policy". One hand doesn't know what the other is doing, it seems.

Secondly, Mr Swain started touting hidden cameras as the next step to lower the road toll. Fortunately, there is local experience on this. It shows hidden speed cameras do not work.

In the late 1990s, the police began a two-year trial of hidden speed cameras in the Waikato-Bay of Plenty. During the trial, the road toll went up, not down. Incredibly, Mr Swain quotes this trial as proving the success of hidden cameras.

Even the LTSA report on the trial states that any conclusion "cannot be attributed per se to hidden speed cameras alone because of the large statistical fluctuations that occur with the small numbers involved". Former Transport Minister Mark Gosche was right when he cancelled the trial, stating it had not cut speeding or road deaths.

The Government must realise that hidden cameras are bad policy unsupported by any scientific evidence.

The third idea from Mr Swain is to copy Victoria and New South Wales by introducing demerit points for speed-camera tickets. In Victoria, when a speed-camera ticket is issued, it is in the name of the vehicle owner. If someone else was driving, the owner and the driver sign a statutory declaration and the fine and demerit points are transferred.

But there is demerit-point trading. It is not uncommon for family members to transfer demerit points among themselves to avoid getting a disqualification period. And in some companies it is not unheard of for other staff to accept demerit points so top salespeople can keep their cars on the road. This avoidance is illegal and dishonest and apparently widespread.

The fact is that Victoria's road toll has remained virtually unchanged for the past 10 years, yet New Zealand's has dropped 37 per cent over the same time - without demerit points.

The New South Wales road toll has fallen only 3 per cent over the same period, despite motorists being hit with double demerit points at times. Why adopt road-safety policies that have failed in Australia?

The authorities must realise that there is more to saving lives than speed cameras. Arguably, safety engineering in cars has had the major impact on reducing crashes and fatalities. Road design has also played a part.

Speed cameras can play a role in known black spots where speeding can be shown to be an important factor in accidents.

Road safety is important, but Mr Swain should focus more on police visibility, inappropriate speed, driver fatigue, seatbelts and drink-driving. Above all, the Government should look around and not ignore the experience and research others have learned.

* National MP Tony Ryall is a former Minister of Justice.

From:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=3538926&thesection=news&thesubsection=dialogue

My emphasis

 


 
 Respond to this message   
AuthorReply
bogush
(Login bogush)
Forum Owner
81.77.17.88

And "They" Say That There Is No Evidence That Hi Viz Cameras Work!

December 12 2003, 10:39 PM 

As well as the New Zealand experiment above,

There's the Bristol experience in this thread:

Cars & Stripes For All To See

And lot's more I should imagine!

 


 
 
bogush
(Login bogush)
Forum Owner
81.77.17.88

Bright Gatsos

December 12 2003, 10:43 PM 

Bright Gatsos work

The first UK trial of a Bright Gatso was a huge success. When the Gatso camera installed at an accident blackspot on the A3064 was painted in red-and-yellow stripes, speeding dropped 80% and injury accidents dropped 43%. This is far higher than any figures achieved by grey Gatsos. Bright Gatsos are also used with great success in countries like the Netherlands........

From:

http://www.benlovejoy.com/lobbying/bright-gatsos_main.html

 


 
 
Jack Russell
(no login)
195.92.67.209

Re: Down Under Evidence Of Underhand Scam &quote;Statistics&quote;

December 13 2003, 11:53 PM 

Yet more boring tedious ****e. Don't you sad gets have anything better to do with your time?

 
 
Hanbo...
(no login)
62.254.0.30

Bright Gatsos

December 14 2003, 10:58 AM 

>"Bright Gatsos work!

Of course they do!
We've been saying this for years!

High Visibility 'Safety' Cameras 'DO' remind drivers to check their speed and may help to slightly reduce road accidents, but they cannot prevent road deaths occuring as statistics prove that over 90% of all road fatalities do not involve 'Excessive Speed' anyway, and that a percentage of the fatalities involving 'High Speed' are caused by police vehicles during pursuits, which is why police chiefs are now ordering their officers not to engage in Chases !!!

The fact that these 'High Visibility Cameras' will not generate countless millions of pounds to enable 'Scam Partners' to live exotic lifestyles means that they must continue to remain concealed/disguised, etc.!!



 
 
Anonymous
(no login)
62.254.0.30

Re: 'SCAM PARTNERS'

December 14 2003, 12:07 PM 

Hidden Cameras = Luxury!


>"The fact that these 'High Visibility Cameras' will not generate countless millions of pounds to enable 'Scam Partners' to live exotic lifestyles (>"NEWSFLASH..........Scamera Partnership officials spotted buying one way tickets to South America....................") means that they must continue to remain concealed/disguised, etc.!!


Aaaahhhhh, The Carribean, Luxurious Mansion's, Villa's, Yachts, Private Jet's, Champagne, Caviar, Gorgeous young Women, Fast Car's,............
Ehh!? WOT!? FAST CAR's!?.... FUUUUUUUUK !!



 
 
Anonymous
(no login)
62.254.0.30

Re: Down Under Evidence Of Underhand Scam &quote;Statistics&quote;

December 14 2003, 3:26 PM 

Unbelievable sad boring gits. Get a life or get help!

 
 
bogush
(Login bogush)
Forum Owner
81.79.117.217

Speed Cameras Absent From Accident Blackspots

December 29 2003, 7:38 AM 

29.12.2003
By Suart Dye and Wayne Thompson

Not one of the country's worst road crash blackspots has a speed camera, the Herald can reveal.

The 10 most dangerous spots in New Zealand have between them seen 84 horrific crashes and claimed 11 lives in the last four years.

But none of the sites, which range from Auckland to Wellington and Waitakere to Christchurch, has a permanent speed camera.

Land Transport Safety Authority officials maintain that most accidents at these sites are caused by failure to give way, not speeding.

[Well. there's a surprise!]

However, four of the sites have been mobile speed camera spots, they say.

[So why?]

Tony Ryall, the National Party's police spokesman, said the Government was more interested in gathering revenue than catching speedsters.

Despite a record number of speeding tickets issued this year, the road toll was at its highest since 2000, he said.

"Speed cameras have a role as a deterrent - they slow people down.

"But until they are used at the crash blackspots, the public will continue to see them as a way of bringing in cash," said Mr Ryall.

The LTSA has several different lists of accident blackspots based on varying criteria, such as crashes per kilometre and the volume of traffic.

This list refers to sites with the worst crash history in terms of fatal or serious injury accidents since 1998.

It includes the intersection of Fanshawe and Beaumont Sts in Auckland, with six serious injuries and one death; the State Highway 2 intersection with Te Tumu Rd in western Bay of Plenty, which has claimed four lives and seen two serious injuries; and the intersection of Taranaki St and Courtenay Place in Wellington, with five serious injuries.

"If this Government was focused on saving lives and road safety, speed cameras would be placed at these spots," said Mr Ryall.

Transport Minister Paul Swain said the placing of cameras was an operational matter between police and the LTSA, who analysed crash sites.

Placements so far had the desired effect of cutting accident rates dramatically.

Mr Swain said the Government's move this month to let police use speed cameras "anytime, anywhere" gave flexibility to shift the cameras quickly to spots with a rising accident rate.

He expected that police officials would raise the issue of buying more cameras when he met them in the New Year to talk about the flexible policy.

Inspector John Kelly, of the commissioner's road policing office, said permanent cameras cost $30,000 to $40,000 to install.

[I thought they paid for themselves - speed kills - if they save just one life!]

They were placed where a history of crashes related to speed.

[But I thought all crashes related to speed - speed kills - kill your speed - if it saves just one life]

Andy Knackstedt, LTSA spokesman, said failure to give way contributed to 23 per cent of crashes at urban intersections.

"They are not speeding, so it would not make sense to have speed cameras there."

Automobile Association northern manager Stephen Selwood said the notorious blackspots were on busy roads and should justify the expense of replacing intersections with bridges.

From:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=3541336&thesection=news&thesubsection=general

 


 
 
bogush
(Login bogush)
Forum Owner
81.79.117.217

Errrrrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

December 29 2003, 7:40 AM 

Note the contrast between the pro Greed Scamera, and the real pro road safety arguments above.

 


 
 
Anonymous
(no login)
62.254.0.30

Re: Down Under Evidence Of Underhand Scam &quote;Statistics&quote;

December 29 2003, 7:42 AM 

But I thought all crashes related to speed - speed kills - kill your speed - if it saves just one life]


Then you must be even mor gullible than I ever gave you credit.

Who said that?

 
 
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