Re: how do u cause excruciating pain to an opponent?
December 27 2003, 7:45 PM
I would say that fire is the most excruciating pain. Did anyone ever get a minor burn. That pain lasts for hours and there is no ointment one can put on to stop the pain. So burns are the most excructiating pain.
Jail House Boxing aka 52blocks, aka Jail House Rock
December 28 2003, 12:14 PM
Their is said to be a very highly secretive fighting system, whithin the prison system derived of some nasty fighting techniques and the names I've heard it by is called " Jail House Rock", "52-blocks", now from doing some research with people I know of that has been in the prison I was told their is no such thing. I have gotten this source from liable sources on 2 sides of the racial fence. From very reliable Black and White Friends of mine. Who have both served some time within the Prison System. In 2 different states even. But what I did find is that they said Martial Arts such as JKD,TKD,KungFu,Karate,and boxing are said to be practiced within the prison along w/ also YOGA.
One of the guys showed me the JKD he said to have learned within and its very much JKD that he shown me so I was impressed at the least to find that out. If any "people" that learn the deadly art of fighting im sure its those thats been in prison because that's probably the most deadly arena in the world known to man. My black friend told me he never studied any fighting style while in prison because it would'nt matter if someone marked you their wasn't anything you knew or could do to protect yourself. You were as good as dead regaurdless of how good a fighter you was. So he said learning any martial art was a waste of time. He said the best way of survival was to stick to your own race or group ie. gang etc...which is why in prison their are so many violent attacks also.
He said it dont matter if you are white and your buddy of 20yrs is black or asian or whatever once you go to prison you forget you two are friends becuause thats just the way it is in there. Its funny because one of my aquantinces the white guy went into prison kinda the typical white guy thug / gangster and came out a white neo nazi type "BIKER" so its gotta be some truth to the whole thing.....
But also for that matter some excruciating pain techniques, that I find is "eyejabs, trachea strikes/grabs, finger or joint locks, groin strikes, nerve or pressure point attacks." these to me are some of the most excruciating attacks w/ an empty hand outside of the obvious breaking of bones one can inflict on another person. Oh and their is Hair Immobilization but some people "mostly women" are unbothered by that one sometimes.
Just my observations...
This message has been edited by IMAA on Dec 28, 2003 12:18 PM
Thje great Buce Lee is the greatest fighter ever inm the history of fighting and world. Dont mater who before or after cos he was sent from god as was a profet. He was like the Jeesus of the martial art world and no man can ever match him with super powers he was aslo faster than any man ever lived
Hahahahahahhaa ahahahahhahhaahhahha now that was the most hilarious thing I have ever heard. Not to mention the most blasphemous remark that any one can make.
No we just talk of strete fighter cos we all know sport fighters cant fight. We know they cant street fight strete fithers wou;d poke them in eyes and sprt fighters would be blind cant see them go bang pow boom and hits them in knees groin and they would go down cos they dont know how to really figt they just hit you hard and kick you hard but it really doesnt huirt cos they arent strete figters who really know how
No offense in this post. I think some boxers can fight in real life because in most street fights the conflict starts with in close range(a boxers specialty). Besides this this, boxers are taught and are pretty effective with footwork, evasion techniques, and are very fast. They are strong, have good cardio, reflexes, and good fighting instincts. I agree a very dedicated and experienced street fighter could probably beat any boxer, but how do we know that the boxer person hasn't had any other training in something else? If Ali was alive, would you fight him? Still, no offense, just trying to make a point.
NO ONE thats right no one is the greatest fighter of all time . Because no one can say or even know who all has fought and who have they fought. Even the scool bully can not beat half the people who are afrid to fight him. They just do not know they can. Real life is allways progressing and no end into who is best now and then or was at that time.
Maybe the boxer has better attributes than a "street fighter. Maybe his sense of timing is better. Maybe he's tougher due to all those hours of soaking up and dishing out punishment. Maybe he knows how to fight dirty as well.
Maybe, just maybe, they're better than so-called "street" fighters because they have more experience fighting against true resistance. The jab can be turned into an eye jab as easily as opening the hand. In fact, I'd give a boxer more credit than I would a "street" fighter any day of the week.
what's with these morons that think tournament fighters can't fight on the street? what do you think tournaments are? THEY ARE FULL CONTACT SPARRING. And sparring is the closest thing to fighting. so don't give me any of this crap. Who would you rather fight? Mike Tyson? or some drunk bum?
Mike Tyson. I would be all over the news for it and make lots of money, regardless if I win or lose. The other guy wouldn't be fun because it wouldn't be a fight for me.
This message has been edited by Lenmaster on Dec 31, 2003 12:19 AM
You know what really burns me up? Is how many simple martial artist that are against the sporting side of martial arts. What I dont get is how they think they can whoop everyone on the street, but yet can't whoop anyone in the ring.
When you think of tournament fighting your thinking of point sparring like that of karateka or TKD. I've fought in these type tournaments and granted its very unreal but you still can get banged up pretty good in this type of fighting.
They don't think stepping into a cage or a mat w/ a grappler, or boxer/kickboxer I always hear " yea on the street I"d kill ya" hahaha, the funny thing is, what makes you think those guys that fight for $ or for fun in he cage or ring can't street fight? I know a few cage fighters and these are some of the toughest street fighters, who get their kicks by going to the local pubs /bars and are either bouncers, or cause fights. I"ve seen a few of them fight for real and they know all the dirty little tricks that the simple martial artist claim to know too.
I've seen these fighters not only handle one guys but several guys and come out victorious. So if your one of those guys who like to think that your the baddest, street fighter just because you know a few dirty tricks and never fight I say put your money where your mouth is. If I dare say take your rear end and put it in a cage or ring and see how you fair. My thing is this, if you can fight and win and come out victorious with the gloves on, chances are your gonna be that much better without them. The bottom line is this, when you fight and its a real battle regaurdless how good you are, your gonna feel it the next day in your muscles and bruises. Or maybe its just me, cause when I usually get in fights Im normally getting into it with the guys that are not punks, and that can fight. I"ve never just been in a street fight with some little kid that dont know how to fight, or you can scare off. Normally in my circumstances, my past real fights have not been fun nor all that pretty. Even when I come out ahead because their is no winners, I still come up scared and bruised.
Just the reality of fighting.
I give boxers just as much if not more credit than "street fighters" i mean one name says it all roy jones jr. hes a killa fighter...and even tho u may think hes little...hes quick and strong
Answer to first question about what is the most excructiating pain. It would have to be fire because I know people who are nurses and they say the worst place for anyone to be in a hospital is the burn unit. Plus, I knew firemen who have gotten 3rd degree burns and it took them many months to even get healed. Look at Sept. 11th, 2001 just as a reminder.
Answer number 2 - Who's the greatest fighter of all time? Okay, it's me! Seriously, what is this website about?
In relation to IMAAs post. You are correct. People seem to think ring sports have no use on the street which is ridiculous. I am due for my first Muay Thai fight in February and i expect to fell battered and briused for days. The combat is the same just in different surroundings all a fighter must due is adapt. Just my Point of view
The greatest fighter of all time? You mean non-sport, no rules, anything-goes streetfight? Well I don't know the answer to "all time" because I haven't seen every fighter from every time period of mankind. I can answer the question in the context "that I know of". I don't have one but a top ten list in no particular order of skill:
1. Rickson Gracie - (the best Gracie. 400 fights, one loss by disqualification. Now retired.)
2. Bruce Lee - (founder of Jeet Kune Do and died undefeated)
3. Morihei Ueshiba - (the founder of Aikido and died undefeated)
4. Frank Shamrock - (Ken Shamrock's younger brother from the UFC. 4 time middleweight champion. Retired undefeated. In my opinion the best well-rounded and conditioned figher in UFC history)
5. Finnigan - (the puppet dog that was Casey's friend from Mr. Dress-up. Kicked the unliving hell out of Mr. Bill and slapped David and Goliath around like a couple of useless bitches. This living weapon made of wool would not hesitate to bust a cap in your a$$ if you mocked his show or the Master Pimp Dress-up)
6. Mike Tyson - (I don't care what you say. Even outside the ring, this man can wreck you so bad that you feel that you have been hit by a car. This man was the Muhammed Ali of the 80's)
7. Roy Jones Jr. - (The current best, well-conditioned, fastest, and skilled boxer of any weight class.)
8. Miyamoto Musashi (The greatest Japanese swordsman who ever lived. Equally skilled unarmed. 60 fights. No losses. Died at 61 years of age undefeated).
9. Ron Prather (The undeniable, living, breathing, nuclear weapon of webkwoon.com fame. This 6' 4, 210 lbs. of fertilizing cow manure with pasted on pubic hairs for a gotee and 5 lb. fish bowl spectacles, powerful enough to fry ants on a sunny day can rip apart a phone book with his bare hands, has a 2000 psi punch, and can still knock off a bench press with a volkswagon while under the influence of elephant tranquilizers unfazed)
10. Jiyasa - (The Jet Li terminator still roams the
lizard-infested outback Crocodile Hunter land of Australia. One of only two living JKD legends that occupy the continent, the Jiyasa takes the form of the creature called Naz when concocting a new anime cartoon of his free martial arts videos he hands out over the net depicting him mimicking Bruce Lee while annihalating countless agent Smith's from the Matrix with relative ease)
This message has been edited by Lenmaster on Jan 8, 2004 12:19 AM
LOL! NWFish, I almost forgot about good 'ol NWFish!
My favorite line was that one time he wrote a post saying "I have beaten down two men that were beating on their wives. And I will do it again!!!!!" And someone responded saying "I have beaten off in front of two men that were beating off in front of their wives. And I will do it AGAIN"!!!!
I believe that question is uknown because the greatest fighter is the fighter that believes he is, the man who is in his prime of his skills, the man who puts forth more effort while his opponents are sleeping Its quite uknown??
Between a street fighter or tournament fighter i would say whichever one performs the best it depends upon who your tlkin bout and there skills in the ring and outside the ring and there modivation
Wow! Hey buddy no offense but you really should invest time in an english class. I don't mean to pick on you but your spelling and sentance structuring is horrible! I hope you are not over the age of 30, because the older you are talking like that, the worse it makes you look.
The one who has learned to fight . But only will fight if he must. Then never brag of that deed. But goes on living his life as just a person. As no greatest fighter has yet to be born. Many people make up this earth. And one can never fight them all. But we can all learn to live just as we learn to fight. As life its self sometimes becomes the fight. Learn from it what you will. The greatest fighter you may never know. But you may know a person who can fight and is great in your eyes. For the things he has done. To make life great.
"jkddragon", you spelled SENTENCE wrong. If your going to insult someone about a few little mistakes (seriously, his sentence structure and spelling isn't THAT bad) then at least make sure YOUR post has NO MISTAKES EITHER.
Lenmaster's list is right on the money, especially #9, but Frank Shamrock was not undefeated. He was undefeated in UFC but not MMA. If you are talking about all time you must consider his entire fight record. More like 20 - 7, although I agree he is one of the best ever even with 7 losses. Most of his losses were against great fighters that he beat later in rematches.
Jiyasa, no one is perfect and it is true that I mispelled sentence as "sentance". But this is what his paragraph said:
"I believe that question is uknown because the greatest fighter is the fighter that believes he is, the man who is in his prime of his skills, the man who puts forth more effort while his opponents are sleeping Its quite uknown??
Between a street fighter or tournament fighter i would say whichever one performs the best it depends upon who your tlkin bout and there skills in the ring and outside the ring and there modivation"
----------------------------------------------------
1. He spelled "unknown" wrong twice. He spelled it uknown.
2. He spelled "I" in a lower case i all by itself.
3. He spelled "talking" as tlkin.
4. He spelled "about" as bout.
5. He spelled "their" as there when he was referring to a definition of possession. You only say "there" when talking about a location.
6. He spelled "motivation" as modivation.
7. He spelled "you're" as your. Your is only used as a possession. When you are talking about doing an act, you are is simplified in "you're".
And his entire way of structuring a paragraph is horrid. There are no punctuations on where some of the sentences end or start. Plus in some sentences he starts out with a statement but for some reason it ends in a question mark. Is he telling us something or asking us? It should have really been created in this way:
"I believe that question is unknown because the greatest fighter of all is the fighter that believes he is. A man who is at the prime of his life physically is going to be at the height of his skill level. This is a man who is going to put the maximum effort into his skills. (I excluded the rest of this paragraph because I couldn't make any sense out of it).
Between a street fighter or a tournament fighter, I would say the person that would win would be whichever one performs the best. It depends upon who you're talking about, and their skill in and outside of the ring. Motivation is also a crucial element in deciding the outcome of such an encounter."
You are comparing my one mistake to his seven on spelling alone. This is not even including the multiple sentence structuring errors. Before you jump into something that doesn't involve you directly, please take note that I wasn't talking to you so mind your own business. If I didn't ask your opinion to begin with, I'm not really interested in hearing it.
How can Frank Shamrock be the best ever, when he has only had 27 professional fights? Benny Equirdez had what 67 TITLE fights where he was undefeated. He was 47 on his last pro fight, where he beat a 25 year old world kickboxing champ. This is more like a record of a "greatest fighter". How many Muay Thai fights have you seen (actual ones from Thailand), where some of these guys have had several hundred fights at top class level before they retire. I watched this one guy who had 400 and something pro fights. More than Rickson Gracie and he won the vast majority.
The UFC and generally the other MMA tournaments you get on western TV is still quite young and highly commercial. Do not make the mistake of believing that the best fighters in the world are on the UFC. Hell the UFC only really started making headway in the UK about 2 years ago and still yet to attract to the UKs top fighters and the UK is not exactly the mecca for MA. For that you have to go to Asia and they have their own NHB tournaments that have been around a lot longer.
Lenny you put in Mike Tyson in there, but no Mohammed Ali. Whats with that?
You put in the founder of Aikido, yet he existed in a time of peace (as far as unarmed combat is concerned) and who did he fight that makes his undeafeted record so great. How often did he beat the founder of Judo (I think his name was Jiagro Kano) whom he was both friend and admirer of. Indeed was inspired to develop Aikido after Kano's development of Judo as a non violent way of developing the spirit. Are we giving points here because someone founded a style and made it commercially succesful. Remember commercial succss is not equal to great fighting ability.
"How can Frank Shamrock be the best ever, when he has only had 27 professional fights? Benny Equirdez had what 67 TITLE fights where he was undefeated. He was 47 on his last pro fight, where he beat a 25 year old world kickboxing champ. This is more like a record of a "greatest fighter". How many Muay Thai fights have you seen (actual ones from Thailand), where some of these guys have had several hundred fights at top class level before they retire. I watched this one guy who had 400 and something pro fights. More than Rickson Gracie and he won the vast majority."
Wow this guy wants to argue LOL. Well if you really care why I think the way I do consider who Ron Van Cleef is. That man is a martial arts legend with 10 different black belts under his name. The guy fought for a long time. Much longer than Royce Gracie. When
he stepped up to Royce, it didn't take Royce very long to pretty much throw those black belts out the window so to speak. And Royce is only (at the time) a 3rd or 4th degree black belt in his one art. The whole point is this: Ron and Benny are both stand up martial artists that don't know the ground. They both would meet the same fate in either the hands of Royce or Frank. The best stand up guys that don't know the ground are at an immediate disadvantage when they walk in the octagon. As far as Rickson goes and having other guys have more than 400 fights, it could happen. Not arguing. But if you read my post right, you would have also understood "I have never seen every fighter on earth so I will say that I know of instead". Besides, Muy Thai fights are not as well rounded as the UFC. I remember what happened to Orlando Bloom (think that's his name) who met that Swedish jujistu guy in one of the first 5 UFC's and the Thai guy got thrown to the floor and elbowed into unconciousness. I have lots of repect for Thai boxing for what it is. I use Thai techniques in my concepts training so I see the validity in it. But Thai in it of itself is limiting because of it's lack of ground work and it's lack of compactness in it's defense and stance. And that guy that won the majority of Thai fights that were over the count of 400 doesn't exactly match up to winning them all like Rickson. The only fight Rickson lost I don't really consider a loss cause it was a disqualification. Someone didn't know the rules or some b.s. like that. I would put my money on Rickson rematching that same guy if anyone has doubts.
"The UFC and generally the other MMA tournaments you get on western TV is still quite young and highly commercial. Do not make the mistake of believing that the best fighters in the world are on the UFC. Hell the UFC only really started making headway in the UK about 2 years ago and still yet to attract to the UKs top fighters and the UK is not exactly the mecca for MA. For that you have to go to Asia and they have their own NHB tournaments that have been around a lot longer."
I never said the best fighters in the world are on the UFC. I think they are the best "conditioned" and "well-rounded". There is a difference between that and "the best" in everything. Sure the regular martial artists have more better balance, form and have body mechanics. Half of those UFC fighters are just great grapplers that are big and strong. Most of their stand up game specifically resemebles over-sized sloppy apes trading punches to see which one is tougher.
"Lenny you put in Mike Tyson in there, but no Mohammed Ali. Whats with that?"
Sorry about that. My mistake.
"You put in the founder of Aikido, yet he existed in a time of peace (as far as unarmed combat is concerned) and who did he fight that makes his undeafeted record so great. How often did he beat the founder of Judo (I think his name was Jiagro Kano) whom he was both friend and admirer of. Indeed was inspired to develop Aikido after Kano's development of Judo as a non violent way of developing the spirit. Are we giving points here because someone founded a style and made it commercially succesful. Remember commercial succss is not equal to great fighting ability."
He fought in a time of peace. So in other words if the world is nice and peaceful as a whole, there is no way you can be an effective fighter if someone decides to attack you during a period like that huh? LOL If you want to argue that, why are you on a JKD forum? Bruce Lee never fought in any tournaments or a time when he was developing Jeet Kune Do where the man had to fight everyday to make it home to his weights and wooden dummy. He only had only a handful of eye-witness accounts of streetfights against nobody's. He is considered the greatest thing since sliced bread on here. At least that's what everyone else on this board claims. But going back to Morihei Ueshiba, everyone that challenged him, (which was people from all over ...boxers, wrestlers, martial artists from other styles all took their shots at him). The old man duped em all. That's why I am saying what I am saying. No one could touch him. Jigaro Kano is the founder of Judo and what is Judo? A sport version of Jujitsu! In English, that translates as a limited and less deadly version of Jujitsu. Aikido was never meant to be a sport. That's like saying well how well would Jhoon Rhee (the Father of American Taekwondo) fare against Fumio Demura, the karate expert. My answer is....who cares. One might win or they both might cancel each other out. I said what I said on this post cause it was supposed to be my opinion. But opinions are like a$$holes cause everyone has one so it's no biggie. I have to admit that I am flattered that you even responded to my opinion. Most people carry on and on like you never even posted anything lol. But thanks for asking.
This message has been edited by Lenmaster on Jan 14, 2004 1:51 AM
