I'm just curious, and would like to know what you all think when it comes to kicking in REAL fights. Would you kick at all? Only below the waist? Only below the neck? Or completely all out?
Personally I use very little kicks in fights (compared to the use of my hands at least), mainly to set up and close gaps, and for going downstairs every now and then while I'm attacking upstairs to create confusion and structure loss. Or attack downstairs to distract, inflict pain, and hurt the base for a more reliable high-line hit. I would rarely kick above the waist, but I do see some merit in doing so if you're flexible and fast enough, which I am. I have kicked peoples heads in real fights (only twice to be exact, once with a lead leg side kick, the other time with a rear thai kick, both resulting in knock outs), and I think mid-line hits cause a bit more damage than low-line when it comes to kicks (ribs, solar plexus, vital organs, etc. + the power of your legs = SOME CRAZY DAMAGE!), even though it's more risky.
Of course this only concerns hand to hand combat. I would never risk a kick above the waist if my opponent can slash my leg with a knife. And when it comes to mass attacks, I wouldn't kick at all (for obvious reasons).
This message has been edited by Masamune_77 on Mar 30, 2004 7:12 PM
I dont rely on just kicks, but if they can help me in a certain situation i will use them. I also think that kicking to the head is not the smartest idea in most cases unless your talking about stomping on the persons head when their on the ground.
Lately I've been working on my punches. A punch is faster then most kicks, but I would bring out a kick to keep the opponent guessing. I think a good Round house to the Leg works fine, but to really surprise him, set up a punch combo and end it with a round house to the side of his head... He wouldnt see that one coming.
I believe kicking above the waist does work in some instances, but I donīt use it, because it is too risky
As for leg kicks, I donīt believe in the thai/roundhouse kick to the leg because it usually requires more than one kick to chop them down.
Also, knee kicks arenīt near as effective as most say they are. I havenīt seen one knee broken in NHB and it is not against the rules. Also, my kicking might not be that great, but I also have not been able to break knees although I have tried quite a few times.
I favor soccer kicking and stomping against a downed opponent.
Also I like to use the front/oblique kick at close range when he canīt see the kick coming, so it makes him quite unbalanced
I like the Thai kick most IN THEORY, but I think my side kick is my best combat kick. Not the skipping, "Bruce Lee" side kick mind you, but just a pick-your-leg-up-and-throw-it side kick.
By the way I'VE GOT A DIGITAL CAMERA!!! Kyle's mom let us use hers, so I should have some footage up soon, (well, if I can figure out how the damn thing works).
Kicks are by far the most difficult of techniques to apply in a fight. I do however use them a lot. The stop kick is my favorite and recently I have started making my roundhouse pay off. I have also finshed a number of fights with my back kick.
To Wasim
I have not broken any knees mostly because I have stopped myself from hitting full on there when I am sparring. Admittedly it is very difficult to break knees if you hit them at the wrong spot. You will notice that some parts around your knee are weak and some parts are stong.
What I have done quite often is place my foot on the inside of the opponents knee and push down making them fall over. This usually is a follow on from a stop kick.
Kicking the legs is also a useful technique. The results may not be immediately obvious but usually in an unconditioned fighter the opponent will lose speed and balance in that leg helping you win overall (on a conditioned fighter it takes a few goes).
I do not limit myself to kicking low or kicking high. I practice to kick wherever I want and spar with that attitude.
Before anyone says kicking high leaves you vunerable, let me say kicking low leaves you vunerable in fact anything you do has a vunerability. The trick is to get the timing right. I have yet to see someone take a proper (i.e. follow through) kick to the head and stay up.
Yes Jack, Youīre right. No doubt a good kickboxer could drop someone with a high kick(or anyone with decent leg skills). Iīm not that good with kicks anyway.
In my way....i do always use kick than punch in reality fight(accroding stituation). A kick =3 times power of a punch !
So if u can speed up your kick to a perfect speed u can control the disadvantage ! your oppenent would let u just punch on them, they avoid back @ counter too. when they do that our distance becamo more far so to overcome it , kick is the most longest weapon in our body , so use it wisely.......what the chinese say:"long can overcome short , short to can overcamo long!" Example..Great Bruce Lee always use kick to defeat his enemy who always use punch . He remain a distance between his opponent and used this method to win . Plus he had also learnt some TKD ...HIS KICK IS UNBEATABLE.
"kick = 3 times power of punch!" How can you make a claim like that? I seriously doubt mike tyson could kick harder than he can punch, simply because he doesn't know how to kick
Footwear soles that does not slip shoes or boots tight shoe lace. Loose clothing i.e not tight jeans that restrick movement. ( Normally no clothing restrict punch arm.) Weapons equal the situation by using a weapon kicks if no other choice only. Kicks can be countered by a boxer punch the leg boxing has a range that can counter kicks. kicks can can counter a kick i.e kicks the kicking leg front kick thai round kick angulaged, side kick angulaged front shin kick. The savate jkd foot work kicks is best the sidekick with preperation no direct attack fast recovery if miss will not fall over due to shoes or boots or loose shoe lace. If street has good foot work i.e runs hapazard and dodge must alter foot work to be able to catch with kicks.
Thai low round kicks can be countered by kicking the same leg not blocking it as normally in the ring, internation rules of thai boxing forbits kicks to the knee or must agree inside the led or outside the led before the match. JKd front kicks to groin no cambering just stragiht to target surprise speed and timing. Shin kick angulated to southpaw against left lead hit on blind side and weak left hand side confused oponent as usually kicks the other way round.
Street foot is the problem with kicks as the opponent usually runs dodge and move not in a classical mamner or stance wise.
A punch can be countered by a punch to the punching hand. Jab counter hook punch to the punching arm ( head back reflex as in boxing and rear hand iron palm) Remove the illusion of using the hand as a weapons/ i.e weapon used on the wrist swolled knuckle not punch vertically as in the right out punch the punchinghand not trying to punch the head. Use body evasion angulation and footwork to outpunch the punching hand. The illusion of boxing street hand superioty removed(sticks to the forearm inside or outside. Punching boxing is only for one opponent only where in the ring do you have multiple opponent. Only were there is an opening or create one and used other tactics pulling the hands i.e dirty tactics but realistic. Sorry no gloves on the street nor wraps miss a punch halo pavement no ropes to lean on well that enought for now. Wake up to the reality of punching in the street can be very dangerouns to the person punching.
People don.t talk like that around here sound familiar. Well grammar sentence construction and spelling don.t help because over intellectualization can hinder understanding. Get rid of internal chatter and preconcieve ideas and use common sense. Try that grammar and spelling stuff and sentence construction with someone on drugs or a criminal. I get your drift behind all this there is a lack of understanding of yourself hide behind intellectualizem like the spelling and the construction, well too logical and not facing up to the reality of the consequence of words and dialogue. Know the vanacular and don.t be a steoreotype interllectual causes a lot of problem for yourself and other people. Talk the talk and understand uh naz. Keep pumping the biceps, funny one about real fights on your forum. How your iq shot up lately.
This message has been edited by paksao on Apr 23, 2004 2:30 PM
Just curious has anyone within the last month increase their speed i.e. seeing early and reaction time usuing JKD principles. Re-lead shin kick and side kick. According to Dan inosanto Bruce increased his speed with JKD training methods. Just like a track athelete can you run faster, tennis player see opening early and read moves within the last month using JKD principles just curious.
Well I only kick if i know what i'm doing. If it's a specific move I am doing then I might. People say it being a wussy to kick. They're still lying in a bloody heap though arent they?
Only you know what you are doing now one else can. See which muscle is holding you back balance and footwork, deceptiveness in attacking angle. Only you can do all this not from the confines of Bai jong stance, research and enjoy your on progress and monitor and keep a diary and see what Bruce has left you to enjoy.
That,s very good it reveals your true inner thoughts it free form writing. Sentences that string together are only for demonstration purpose (final outcome is predictable follows linear logic) how you think is how your martial is.
Naz you have been caught in(but you were out moonwalking.) But you were not out moonwalking because you were not in. Do the JKD moonwalk. But you have been caught out on your forum but you were in, well done.
If paksoa is a computer then the spider spins his yarn and reveals himself. Wisdom is not an act it it a state of being. Reveals you web and let all the JKD community see your spider i.e. your JKD.
How high is the web for the spider does not know, is it higher than the spider or lower. This is wisdom of JKD simple direct and not confused. Reveal your spider web (Grasshopper).
Know nothing your just answered that question everything the answer you never arrived at. Simple enough for you, but complex as direct and simple that you want it to be. Your JKD shows up in your anwers and you know (nothing) result talking to yourself and expressing your JKD
JKD too adaptable and efficient for you is that why you don,t do JKD. Don,t admit to any weak points in your own art and only use Sh... as a last resort to defend your own know nothing and question everything.
Youp put words in your own mouth and chew on your own saying. Don,t ignore your own sayings, a troll when you read one don,t see one?. Your mates will recognize your words, a troll and the rest. Keep to the topic and no wondering about troll and the rest. Has meaning only to yourself and your crew.
To answer question "Kicking in REAL fights."
I assume to define "REAL fight" as a fight between an aggressor and defender, which is usually the case.
Kicks are power, and power (as in the social order of man) often gains a respect that it does not deserve.
In a (one on one) "Real fight" the choice of kicking is usually provided when an aggressor make a mistake.
As a defender.. if the choice is provided would I kick? It would depend upon the circustance of the entire situation, and the alternative defences that I may have to better defeat the aggressor.
Regards,
Zhi
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I'm just curious, and would like to know what you all think when it comes to kicking in REAL fights. Would you kick at all? Only below the waist? Only below the neck? Or completely all out?
First of all, don't insult each other on a board, its rude and you dishonor your martial arts teachers by being so petty.
on the topic of kicking, there is no set purpose to kicks in a combat situation.
some kicks are for probing a defense, for instance, a low roundhouse to a calf can gauge his reaction speed, and power kicks can be used for knockouts with the proper setup.
i saw a lot of posts talking about how you prefer to fight with hands. this is all well and good, well trained hands will help a lot in combat, but not training kicks puts you at a disadvantage. without training to see how to throw a kick, you will never know how to stop it. for instance, the spinning back kick is very powerful and fast, but think about it. you must turn your back to deliver it, in that split second you have a chance to advance forward and take him.
so in short, kicking is just a tool of combat and you have to understand it to use it or stop it.
bruce lee always used to emphasise that the lngest weapon on your body is your leags so why notuse them ?
if someone is coming in for a punch and they are already halfway in and you cant land a punch before he cracks you one then you put your leg out of a low side kick to the knee its longer then your arm and will hit him before he hits you !!!!!! good question though i thought about it once myself dani (bruce lee biggest fan)
I like Wasim's kicking style... I really gotta practice more of that.
May 7 2004, 12:35 AM
"I favor soccer kicking and stomping against a downed opponent.
Also I like to use the front/oblique kick at close range when he canīt see the kick coming, so it makes him quite unbalanced"
Throw in some footwork, a soccer type kick, front oblique kick, a Jab and cross punch, and you have yourself a self defence "style" with endless combo possibilities.
